New Pipe and Tubing Cutter In The Works

[mdwalker]

Who gives a sh@# about the controller and who is right or wrong. It's ultimately between the owner and Plasmacam. I'm more interested in the original topic!

[Joe Jones]

The original topic is here. It is just that BAD INFORMATION is being spread to owners about the controller box issue. Old owners (like me) know the scoop, but NEW owners who come here and to other social media sites might be mislead into breaching their controller boxes, which would incur the wrath of PlasmaCam.

You say, "WHO CARES?" Well, there are people out there who have a high level of understanding of microchips and circuitry. These people can remove a chip with "the super secret programming" of the controller box, decompile the coding, and reverse engineer the chip for any nefarious purpose. This is the reason PlasmaCam DOES NOT WANT people to get into the box.

"Why do YOU care, Joe?!" I care, because of all of the HELL we have gone through and CONTINUE to go through, via the last 16(?) "updates" that resulted from a hack of the DesignEdge software by one owner who apparently sold hundreds (?) of Full Monty unlocked versions of DE to God only knows whom. He even called ME to see if I wanted to buy one, but I am not into software piracy, and I had already purchased the Full Monty of upgrades already. so even if his price on the unlocked software was amazing, I would never consider such a purchase. It is one of the burdens of being a conservative. Stealing bothers me.

The resulting repercussions of the hack have materialized in things like:

1. the loss of the use of TEAM VIEWER, which was a FANTASTIC tool for online collaboration of DesignEdge files, for training, or just getting together to work out issues with a file.

2. We now have this %$^&* "COMPUTER NUMBER" which is a total pain in the ass. When I call PlasmaCam about an issue with ONE PC, they will not help me until I read off ALL TEN computer numbers to them. I guess they think I am doing some hijinks behind the scenes with my ten Full Monty seats.

3. This COMPUTER NUMBER also makes it damned difficult to move a DE seat from one PC to another. I have seats on PCs that I haven't fired up in five YEARS or more. I would like to move those seats to other computers, but the clusterf*ck you have to go through to accomplish it makes it very irritating.

4. Because of the hack, we now have to juggle files. Any older seat we may have that has not yet been updated to the current version of 4.53 CANNOT open files created with the newer software. Maybe it is not a problem for YOU, but it is a total PITA for ME.

PlasmaCam has been spinning their wheels for a couple of YEARS now. Rather than improving DesignEdge by adding needed and wanted features, they have all crawled into a cave to huddle down and brainstorm how to protect their software and controller boxes from hackers. This might help THEM, but it leaves us out in the cold. I have DOZENS of features I would like to see added to future DE updates, but the cold steel, barnacle laden rusting barge of the U.S.S. PLASMACAM just moves past us like we were just so much littler floating in the water.

I am just trying to head off a train wreck. Rather than PlasmaCam having to deal with (n) numbers of boxes that have been breached, and deciding to create some gawd awful solution that might cause everyone to have to send in their boxes for the "New and Improved" boxes ... and most certainly at a hefty cost, I believe it is better to TRY to prevent that from happening by getting clarification on the issue of breaching the box by table owners.

I sent an email to support2021@plasmacam.com and I also called and spoke to a nice woman, "Angel" who told me that this is an important issue that needs to be addressed. My email to PlasmaCam told them that I am seeking an official statement from the company that addresses this issue.

I can jump to all sorts of conclusions, but all I know for a fact now is that I have made three attempts to contact Kevin at PlasmaCam thus far, and he has not responded to my request for a recorded telephone interview that I would post on my You Tube channel, wherein he can make an official declaration about PlasmaCam's policy regarding a breach of the controller box by owners or others, whether or not the box is under warranty, and also whether or not said breach would affect the company vs. owner(s) relationship in any way, by manifesting itself as a refusal to repair the box, or a total shut out of support from PlasmaCam.

I will try again. PlasmaCam is so Cloak and Dagger about everything.

Joe

[djreiswig]

Every time I read something like this about PC makes me happy I chose to purchase a different brand table. I hate jumping through hoops. I own my table and I do whatever I want to it.

[rdj357]

Who gives a shit about the controller and who is right or wrong. It's ultimately between the owner and Plasmacam. I'm more interested in the original topic!

Someone feeds on drama, drama, drama. I’ll be waiting for that official statement with bated breath.

Joe, go back to your pipe cutter idea - that looked cool.

[rdj357]

Every time I read something like this about PC makes me happy I chose to purchase a different brand table. I hate jumping through hoops. I own my table and I do whatever I want to it.

Yeah most of us PlasmaCAM users do as well. I’m perfectly happy with them and am happy I chose not to purchase a different brand table.

Po-ta-to, Po-tah-toe.

[Joe Jones]

I got a call from Kevin at PlasmaCam today. We discussed the issue of the tamper rivet, and owners getting into the "guts" of the controller box. He clarified several things:

1. Breaking the tamper rivet DOES violate the license agreement. There are "NO USER SERVICABLE PARTS INSIDE OF THE BOX"

2. Getting into the box interior DOES void the warranty on the box.

3. PlasmaCam MAY still repair a box that is sent to them with the tamper rivet broken, but they will charge you for the repair, even if the box was under warranty. It depends on whether or not PlasmaCam can determine WHY the owner was in the box, and what exactly they DID while in the box. In other words, if you just got in to peek at the "guts" they will still repair the box for the $500.00 fee. However, if you de-soldered the chips, or changed the circuitry, or drill holes, or add wires, or ... or ... or otherwise altered the main components in any way, you are up the proverbial creek.

4. To Kevin's memory, PlasmaCam has NEVER charged an owner the $3,000.00 price tag for a new box, although there were "a few rare cases" where the breach terminated the relationship between PlasmaCam and the owner.

5. ALL of the internal parts are proprietary. There are no "off the shelf" components inside that can be replaced by an owner. Read: There is NO REASON for an owner to gain entry to the interior of the controller box.

Kevin did not want to be recorded, although I would have preferred that you hear this directly from him. Still, I stand correct, that owners have no reason to get into the box, and breaching the tamper rivet DOES void the warranty.

Joe

[Joe Jones]

On the PLUS side, the final bearings arrived today. Well, 190 of 200 ordered anyway. I just ordered a bunch because you know how it is. you find something that WORKS, you buy six of them, and then when you go to get more of them, they are discontinued and you have to go back to the drawing board. With 200 of these bearings, I can build 21 pipe cutters. After that I will look for replacements or substitutes.

I got some cutting done today. The Samson 510 worked flawlessly ... today. so I got the major parts cut, and two of the bearing support brackets. I went to find the 5mm bolts needed to mount the bearings. Sheesh! A stupid 1/4" x 1-1/4" bolt is nineteen cents, but when the SAME SIZE BOLT is "metric" it is 99 cents What a scam! But the bearings fit too loosely on the #10x32 bolts, so I bought the 5mm bolts and nylock nuts for them.

Tomorrow is more cutting and some welding, to get the basic rollers mounted. Then I have to make the torch mast that will give me the 48" diameter capacity I was seeking. So far it is looking really good!

Joe

[adbuch]

I got a call from Kevin at PlasmaCam today. We discussed the issue of the tamper rivet, and owners getting into the "guts" of the controller box. He clarified several things:

1. Breaking the tamper rivet DOES violate the license agreement. There are "NO USER SERVICABLE PARTS INSIDE OF THE BOX"

2. Getting into the box interior DOES void the warranty on the box.

3. PlasmaCam MAY still repair a box that is sent to them with the tamper rivet broken, but they will charge you for the repair, even if the box was under warranty. It depends on whether or not PlasmaCam can determine WHY the owner was in the box, and what exactly they DID while in the box. In other words, if you just got in to peek at the "guts" they will still repair the box for the $500.00 fee. However, if you de-soldered the chips, or changed the circuitry, or drill holes, or add wires, or ... or ... or otherwise altered the main components in any way, you are up the proverbial creek.

4. To Kevin's memory, PlasmaCam has NEVER charged an owner the $3,000.00 price tag for a new box, although there were "a few rare cases" where the breach terminated the relationship between PlasmaCam and the owner.

5. ALL of the internal parts are proprietary. There are no "off the shelf" components inside that can be replaced by an owner. Read: There is NO REASON for an owner to gain entry to the interior of the controller box.

Kevin did not want to be recorded, although I would have preferred that you hear this directly from him. Still, I stand correct, that owners have no reason to get into the box, and breaching the tamper rivet DOES void the warranty.

Joe

You're not telling us anything here that we did not already know. Robert quite clearly stated the facts with regards to controller repair. So I agree - get back to your pipe cutter blog.

[cstroke]

The LDR programming is pretty slick.
Without researching it does anyone know if you can buy just his programming part to use on other machines?

[Joe Jones]

The LDR programming is pretty slick.
Without researching it does anyone know if you can buy just his programming part to use on other machines?

You lost me. "LDR programming?" Did you reply to the wrong post?

Joe

[robertspark]

The LDR programming is pretty slick.
Without researching it does anyone know if you can buy just his programming part to use on other machines?

You lost me. "LDR programming?" Did you reply to the wrong post?

Joe

ldr programming


https://www.plasmaspider.com/viewtopic. ... 25#p200889

[Joe Jones]

ldr programming

https://www.plasmaspider.com/viewtopic. ... 25#p200889

Okay. this explains nothing.

Joe

[robertspark]

ldr programming

https://www.plasmaspider.com/viewtopic. ... 25#p200889

Okay. this explains nothing.

Joe

How does it explain nothing?

You posted a youtube clip showing LDR software programming, earlier in this thread.

[adbuch]

ldr programming

https://www.plasmaspider.com/viewtopic. ... 25#p200889

Okay. this explains nothing.

Joe

How does it explain nothing?

You posted a youtube clip showing LDR software programming, earlier in this thread.

He says his memory is so bad he can't even remember what he had for dinner last night. So I doubt he would remember this. But here it is.

ldr joe blog.jpg

Upon visiting the LDR website, there is no mention of this software as being offered as a stand-alone program. I very much suspect that this is proprietary software only available with the purchase of one of their pipe cutter machines. Please take a look at their website - maybe you will find something that I missed.

David

https://ldrmotionsystems.com/plasma-pip ... e-cutters/

[acourtjester]

Calculating the shape of a tube cut into the side of another tube is not that hard using a CAD program. reshaping to make the cut correctly simply changing the value by the thickness of the tube being cut to make it out of round. Finding the position for each cut the program will tell you the circumference, divide by 2 and locate the center of the reshaped tupe cuts as needed. The CAD program shows the center of each reshaped cutout see attached screenshot. Other calculating for locations or size can be make using the program also. The same type calculation can be make for square or rectangle tubes. Saved as a DFX an run through SheetCam for a file.
Here is a simple tubing cutter I built years ago, switched the motor cable for the Axis you want to spin to the cutter rotational drive.

pipe cutting.JPG

[Joe Jones]

He says his memory is so bad he can't even remember what he had for dinner last night. So I doubt he would remember this. But here it is.

ldr joe blog.jpg

Upon visiting the LDR website, there is no mention of this software as being offered as a stand-alone program. I very much suspect that this is proprietary software only available with the purchase of one of their pipe cutter machines. Please take a look at their website - maybe you will find something that I missed.

David

https://ldrmotionsystems.com/plasma-pip ... e-cutters/

OH! I put that out of my mind. I didn't pay attention to the "LDR" name. I only looked at the potential as a replacement for the PlasmaCam pipe cutting software.

Yes, sadly, my memory really is that bad.

Joe

[Joe Jones]

Calculating the shape of a tube cut into the side of another tube is not that hard using a CAD program. reshaping to make the cut correctly simply changing the value by the thickness of the tube being cut to make it out of round. Finding the position for each cut the program will tell you the circumference, divide by 2 and locate the center of the reshaped tupe cuts as needed. The CAD program shows the center of each reshaped cutout see attached screenshot. Other calculating for locations or size can be make using the program also. The same type calculation can be make for square or rectangle tubes. Saved as a DFX an run through SheetCam for a file.
Here is a simple tubing cutter I built years ago, switched the motor cable for the Axis you want to spin to the cutter rotational drive.
pipe cutting.JPG

That is really cool. I am looking for something that is simple, and does not have a learning curve. The PlasmaCam pipe cutting software upgrade is simple. You enter a few numbers, and it does the rest. A CAD program can do it, but the person must LEARN the CAD program, and I am trying to avoid that.

DesignSpark Mechanical is promising, and it is FREE! They have lots of You Tube training videos too. It is an awesome program! I haven't taken the time to figure out how to use it yet, beyond simple actions to check out the tools, but apparently you can easily draw two (on more) intersecting shapes and "unwrap" the main cylinder to lay out the cut paths. It will also create DXF files that can be imported into designEdge.

I hear that Google Sketch Up can also create the paths easily, and I think it can unwrap a cylinder to create a 2D DXF file.

Of course, a retired guy with the PlasmaCam pipe cutting software and a lot of free time on his hands could simply create a cut file for someone in his spare time. If they have some way to rotate the pipe, then they are golden! Aw, Hell. That would probably create a storm cloud over Colorado that would make the 11:00 news!

Joe

[Joe Jones]

Calculating the shape of a tube cut into the side of another tube is not that hard using a CAD program.

Do me a favor. Make a video showing how you use your CAD program to do this.

Us my example ... a 6" diameter cylinder with a 1/4" wall thickness, and a 3" diameter cylinder perpendicular through it, offset by 1" from the center of the larger cylinder. I'd really like to see that.

Joe

[Joe Jones]

I did more on the cutter today, but I had to make one change. I was originally going to rotate the rollers via the turned fittings I had made, but it creates a problem of feeding a belt through holes and around the rollers. This would require the user to unbolt the tube and wrap the belt around it, and then reassemble it each time. By flipping them around 180 degrees, I solved the problem! I will still use these turnings for the proof-of-concept model, but I will make another one that is cleaner, and has no OOPS!-es in it!

I will probably end up using a toothed aluminum pulley with flanges, similar to the one that drives the gantry and carriage on the PlasmaCam tables. Now that I understand the X and Y resolution settings, I don't need to be super accurate on the diameter of it, since the resolution settings can compensate for minor differences.

Now the 82" belt can be threaded around the two rollers and nine pulleys by hand, without anything being in the way. This is a BIG improvement, and it will cut many minutes off of the setup and tear down procedure.

Today is Wednesday. I will have the rollers done by Friday, and then I have to make the torch mast. No photos to show yet. It is coming along ... slowly.

Joe

[Joe Jones]

I decided to eliminate the possible slippage issue, so I found the perfect pulleys for the pipe cutter! I ordered 20 of them, so I can set up at least nine more to sell when I get this together.

Unfortunately, delivery of these bad boys is slated for the first week (or later) in October. So, more delays.

On the plus side, this just makes the whole thing that much more bitchin'

I will get the rest of the parts together and then mount these when they arrive. I can't wait!!!

Joe

[Joe Jones]

I am thinking of having the main components laser cut, rather than using the plasma table, and then have everything powder coated. If it costs too much to do that, I may just buy a laser table with the capacity to cut them myself. A strong CO2 laser can do it, or maybe a fiber laser... I will check to see what can do what.

Joe

[adbuch]

Calculating the shape of a tube cut into the side of another tube is not that hard using a CAD program. reshaping to make the cut correctly simply changing the value by the thickness of the tube being cut to make it out of round. Finding the position for each cut the program will tell you the circumference, divide by 2 and locate the center of the reshaped tupe cuts as needed. The CAD program shows the center of each reshaped cutout see attached screenshot. Other calculating for locations or size can be make using the program also. The same type calculation can be make for square or rectangle tubes. Saved as a DFX an run through SheetCam for a file.
Here is a simple tubing cutter I built years ago, switched the motor cable for the Axis you want to spin to the cutter rotational drive.
pipe cutting.JPG

Tom - thanks for sharing that! Both the explanation and demonstration video are great, and I'm sure will be useful for others trying to do the same thing.
David

[adbuch]

By the way, Plasmacam Design Edge has a nice program for automatically creating pipe cuts at different angles, square pipe cuts, etc. The pipe cutter software will accommodate pipe/tube sizes from 1.5" up to 13.5" outside diameter.

Design Edge Pipe Cutter Program.jpg

[adbuch]

Calculating the shape of a tube cut into the side of another tube is not that hard using a CAD program. reshaping to make the cut correctly simply changing the value by the thickness of the tube being cut to make it out of round. Finding the position for each cut the program will tell you the circumference, divide by 2 and locate the center of the reshaped tupe cuts as needed. The CAD program shows the center of each reshaped cutout see attached screenshot. Other calculating for locations or size can be make using the program also. The same type calculation can be make for square or rectangle tubes. Saved as a DFX an run through SheetCam for a file.
Here is a simple tubing cutter I built years ago, switched the motor cable for the Axis you want to spin to the cutter rotational drive.
pipe cutting.JPG

Tom - what CAD program are you using in your example above? Thanks!
David

[rdj357]

By the way, Plasmacam Design Edge has a nice program for automatically creating pipe cuts at different angles, square pipe cuts, etc. The pipe cutter software will accommodate pipe/tube sizes from 1.5" up to 13.5" outside diameter.

Design Edge Pipe Cutter Program.jpg

Also worth noting here that those pipe cuts in the Shape Tool are available to all users with the Advanced Design upgrade. I don’t own their pipe cutting attachment so I’m unaware if any other shapes are added or if the main difference is that it adjusts the visible table size?