It is currently Tue Nov 13, 2018 2:16 am

 

Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Learn and share powder coating techniques, experiences, and product knowledge here.
Shane Warnick
Elite Contributing Member
Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 568
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 11:03 pm

Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby Shane Warnick » Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:50 am

So I don't powder coat, yet. I have some guys that do it for me, for around 4.5 cents a square inch over 24" in size, 24" is $20, 18" is $15 and 12" is $10. Under 12" is $5.

So, first question is, when you hang parts I understand there has to be contact with a hook somewhere. There is always a small spot where there is no powder where the hook was when I get my parts back. Is this the norm? There was a time when they had a different guy doing it that I don't remember this issue, but maybe I didn't notice. Seems hard to justify the cost when it's not perfect. I just have a hard time giving a customer something that I know has a spot with paint on it that will rust. So do you guys run into this, and do you just touch up with paint and go on? Or are they doing a sub-par job in your opinion.

Second question, I was thinking about building an oven and doing my own coating. Problem is, time wise, I am not sure I can justify the cost. I mean, these guys are doing it for roughly $6 a square foot, I mark that up 150% so I charge $9 / square foot, and all I do it knock the dross off, drop it off with them and come back and get it. I usually go once a week, so I am picking up and dropping off quite a bit at once. I am making good money and have no risk / investment. How expensive is it to do this? I don't mean to get into it, but how much does it actually cost to shoot the powder and then I have to cycle the oven and invest the time to sandblast and hang and shoot and cure etc. I guess what I am asking is if you had someone that would do yours for this price would you look at bringing it in house, or is there not enough meat on the bone to justify the investment? I am tempted to just let sleeping dogs lie but thought I would ask what you guys thought first.

Thanks in advance for your time on this.
Shane

User avatar
AnotherDano
Elite Contributing Member
Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 816
Joined: Fri Dec 18, 2009 11:52 pm
Location: Laramie, Wyoming
Contact:

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby AnotherDano » Thu Aug 28, 2014 2:21 am

$5.00/sq foot is an average starting point for a lot of us.
You must remember that it's not the amount of powder that sticks to the piece, but the amount that comes out of the gun that must be accounted for.

The hook mark dilemma will always be with us. Ya gotta hang it somewhere and that will leave a mark.
For a 2-coat finish (base + clearcoat) the piece can be hooked in a different spot for the second coat. The mark will still be there but the protection remains. At first, I would use clean hangers and a reamer to clear the hole between coats to get back down to raw metal. But there wasn't always a hole to use. :cry:

My hooks are seldom cleaned. The hang from whatever I grab. The ground is made with an alligator clip. The last step is to remove the clip and shoot the mark. Another problem arises with the second coat. You have to get through the base coat for the best ground. If it was easy, everyone would be doing it. :lol:

I use an emory board to sand down any rough spots and then clear nail polish to provide protection from the elements.
Care can be taken to choose a good spot to hang the piece from. Tight corners can be good- if you can get the emory board in there.
Dano Roberts
[email protected]
PlasmaCam DHC-2 v3.11
Hypertherm PowerMax-30
Serving Laramie, Wy since Thursday

Largemouthlou
Elite Contributing Member
Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 1372
Joined: Mon Aug 30, 2010 5:56 am
Location: Palm Bch Gardens Fl
Contact:

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby Largemouthlou » Thu Aug 28, 2014 5:12 am

If they are using the thinnest gauge hook for the job then the mark should be very small. On Steel I would say you probably have to do a good job covering that mark especially for outdoor use. 99% of stuff I cut is out of aluminum so I hang from a spot that won't have any mounting hardware touching or that will have coated mounting hardware so it protects against electrolysis.

If you are doing good biz and making money on the coater's work then to me there is no reason to put out all the money for good equipment and try and to take on a new learning experience. That time and money can be better used to expand your business now with tools that could make your job easier hence more profitable.

Are they using any kind of pretreating chemical? This will also help on the rust issue.
1250 hypertherm
4 X 8 Precision Plasma
CandCnC electronics

kkroger
Posts: 230
Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2014 7:56 pm

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby kkroger » Mon Sep 08, 2014 4:24 pm

I have started making my hooks from Sheet Metal and sharpening the edge to make it as SMALL as possible, the coating generally flows out pretty good.

RevvedAC
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2014 10:26 am

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby RevvedAC » Thu Feb 05, 2015 11:46 pm

Talk to your powdercoater and see if he has touch up paint to match his powders. This way you can dab that hook spot and make it disappear.

motoguy
Elite Contributing Member
Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 1081
Joined: Tue Aug 25, 2015 12:05 pm
Location: Central MO, USA

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby motoguy » Sat Apr 29, 2017 3:31 am

kkroger wrote:I have started making my hooks from Sheet Metal and sharpening the edge to make it as SMALL as possible, the coating generally flows out pretty good.


I know it's an old post, but you're also still active...so... :) I'd like to see your sheetmetal hooks. I'm thinking a triangular profile?
Bulltear 6x12 w/ Proton Z axis & watertable
CommandCNC/Linux w/ Ohmic & HyT options
Hypertherm Powermax 85 w/ machine torch
Solidworks, Coreldraw X7, Inkscape, Sheetcam

kkroger
Posts: 230
Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2014 7:56 pm

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby kkroger » Fri Jun 02, 2017 4:35 pm

Sort of an S hook shape with the edge honed that the part hangs from, I'll see if I can get a pic later.

chips2853
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2017 1:58 pm

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby chips2853 » Fri Jul 21, 2017 7:36 am

I concur with most of the other guys on here that it is almost inevitable to get away with no marks. I usually find the best spot that is the least noticeable and hang it from there. And depending on what the color is and how big the job is you can get nail polish or touch up paint sticks. But its so relative to what you are working with, I mean if you have a 75lb object that is 4 foot long, chances are you need thicker hooks and possibly more than one. So yeah lol I know Im stating the obvious here sorry. But moving the hook on a second coat has helped me a bit to make sure there's not a bare spot.

User avatar
Gamelord
Elite Contributing Member
Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 1625
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:17 pm
Contact:

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby Gamelord » Fri Jul 21, 2017 11:30 pm

Everything I do is wire hung. I have a bare metal rack on the top of my powder booth with welded hooks on it and tie a piece of wire through the project and then hook it onto a metal hook and hang it in the booth, My ground is bolt-fastened to the metal rack so you don't have to worry about hooking it to the project. then when covered I move it to the oven by unhooking the wire loop and then hooking it onto another fixed hook that is in the oven. I just dab nail polish on the spot where the wire is. I zinc coat everything before powder so it is very weather resistant, even where the wire divot is.
Once you take flight, your eyes will forever be turned to the sky." "Lack of appreciation is the worlds biggest crime."

Torchmate 6x14 w/THC Downdraft
Thermal Dynamics Cutmaster 101
Corel Draw / Adobe Illustrator
Torchmate CAD

User avatar
little blue choo
Elite Contributing Member
Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 1455
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2015 10:38 pm
Location: Cherryville NC
Contact:

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby little blue choo » Sat Jul 22, 2017 10:51 am

Hey Gamelord, what do you use to zinc coat your projects? Do you use spray cans or do you use a gun and which coating do you use. Have though about this for my outdoor signs but never followed through on it.

Rick
Rick
Arclight 9600 4x8 table
Hypertherm PM65
Acc. Plate Marker, 4 inch Pipe Cutter, Wood Router package
Quincy Q54 compressor 2 stage, 5hp, 60 gal
Refrigerated air dryer & 4 stage filtration system
Software Mach 3, Sheetcam, Solid Edge 2D, Inkscape

User avatar
Gamelord
Elite Contributing Member
Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 1625
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:17 pm
Contact:

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby Gamelord » Sat Jul 22, 2017 11:13 am

Electroplating. Just use zinc. If you are shooting translucent powder a quick buff of the zinc coating will give a very nice shiny undercoat before powdering. For base powdering, just shoot over the zinc like normal steel. The plating is extremely durable to the weather and the powder seems to stick to it better.
Once you take flight, your eyes will forever be turned to the sky." "Lack of appreciation is the worlds biggest crime."

Torchmate 6x14 w/THC Downdraft
Thermal Dynamics Cutmaster 101
Corel Draw / Adobe Illustrator
Torchmate CAD

User avatar
little blue choo
Elite Contributing Member
Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 1455
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2015 10:38 pm
Location: Cherryville NC
Contact:

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby little blue choo » Sat Jul 22, 2017 2:14 pm

Gamelord wrote:Electroplating. Just use zinc. If you are shooting translucent powder a quick buff of the zinc coating will give a very nice shiny undercoat before powdering. For base powdering, just shoot over the zinc like normal steel. The plating is extremely durable to the weather and the powder seems to stick to it better.

WOW! I'll have to stick with the spray can from local hardware. Electroplating is another can of worms and would be another credit card maxed out!

Rick
Rick
Arclight 9600 4x8 table
Hypertherm PM65
Acc. Plate Marker, 4 inch Pipe Cutter, Wood Router package
Quincy Q54 compressor 2 stage, 5hp, 60 gal
Refrigerated air dryer & 4 stage filtration system
Software Mach 3, Sheetcam, Solid Edge 2D, Inkscape

User avatar
Gamelord
Elite Contributing Member
Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 1625
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:17 pm
Contact:

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby Gamelord » Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:25 pm

It's easier and cheaper than you think.

http://www.eastwood.com/ew-electroplati ... -zinc.html

I started with that one, then upgraded to a larger tank for the bigger stuff and a switching variable volt power supply where I can monitor the amps/volts much easier.
Once you take flight, your eyes will forever be turned to the sky." "Lack of appreciation is the worlds biggest crime."

Torchmate 6x14 w/THC Downdraft
Thermal Dynamics Cutmaster 101
Corel Draw / Adobe Illustrator
Torchmate CAD

User avatar
little blue choo
Elite Contributing Member
Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 1455
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2015 10:38 pm
Location: Cherryville NC
Contact:

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby little blue choo » Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:09 am

Thanks Gameloed, I've purchased many things from Eastwood but have never seen this kit. Did you build a special tray to do your signs in?

Rick
Rick
Arclight 9600 4x8 table
Hypertherm PM65
Acc. Plate Marker, 4 inch Pipe Cutter, Wood Router package
Quincy Q54 compressor 2 stage, 5hp, 60 gal
Refrigerated air dryer & 4 stage filtration system
Software Mach 3, Sheetcam, Solid Edge 2D, Inkscape

User avatar
Gamelord
Elite Contributing Member
Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 1625
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:17 pm
Contact:

Re: Hanging / Hook marks and $ question

Postby Gamelord » Thu Jul 27, 2017 1:04 am

I use a small jar for small items, 5gal bucket for larger and a large 4ft vat for the larger stuff. Just suspend the item from the top with a rod spanned across the top.
Once you take flight, your eyes will forever be turned to the sky." "Lack of appreciation is the worlds biggest crime."

Torchmate 6x14 w/THC Downdraft
Thermal Dynamics Cutmaster 101
Corel Draw / Adobe Illustrator
Torchmate CAD


Return to “Powder Coat”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

Easyscriber engrave attachment for Hypertherm torch's