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Magnetic breakaway and settings

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Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by grindergary » Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:59 pm

I have CandCNC controller and put a new magnetic breakaway on my table.

I am wondering if I should set the stop on fault to active on the cut profile. I am wondering if it will lose position if I should have a crash and the torch mount breaks away like it is supposed to do.

TIA

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by tcaudle » Mon Feb 16, 2015 7:47 pm

A torch crash does not generate a fault. Faults are from volts being (way) out of spec which MIGHT happen when you torch falls off and the arc goes away and the votls drop to zero BUT that would not be instant.

Torchs falling ff are E_STOP events and you won't keep position. If you have homes you will have to note where you are in G-Code and then re-zero XY and Z and execute a "set next line " after you roll back through the code to a spot before the crash

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by Metriccar » Mon Feb 16, 2015 11:58 pm

I have a magnetic breakaway and not too much of a fan of it... I wouldn't be surprised if one day I fried my gantry or side rails... or something worse because it can keep on shooting out an arc for quite some time until I get to it.

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by Capstone » Tue Feb 17, 2015 6:01 am

Metriccar wrote:I have a magnetic breakaway and not too much of a fan of it... I wouldn't be surprised if one day I fried my gantry or side rails... or something worse because it can keep on shooting out an arc for quite some time until I get to it.
This is why I come to this forum; to hear all of the experiences good and bad. I've been thinking about adding one, but under careful consideration, a breakaway, at least for me, might lead to a false sense of safety and to believing I can walk away from the table while in operation. What's the argument from someone that has one to definitely get it in spite of this belief?
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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by grindergary » Tue Feb 17, 2015 8:30 am

Thanks for the replies.

I set up the break away because I had the table running. Cut 6 sheets no problem. It was getting late on the last sheet and I figured I would go start the truck as it was cold and snowing. When I came back in, like less than a minute, the torch dropped in a hole and the gantry kept right on moving. Well tried to. It snapped the head off
IMG_0939.JPG
So that is why I an going to try the break away. Now to learn to trust the table again. Maybe. :lol:

Gary

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by abmetal » Tue Feb 17, 2015 8:37 am

I wouldn't have a table without one. Just yesterday we were cutting 1/2" plate and for reasons unknown the torch took a dive into the plate two different times and each time I figured that magnetic mount saved me some money. Even though it didn't stop immediately, it didn't mess up the cut so all I had to do was put it back on and start the cut again. We never leave the table while it's cutting for that reason. Law of averages...we can stand by it for hours and it'll cut perfectly but leave it alone and crash. Kinda' like a little kid. So my wife or I always stays close.

I remember reading about someone adding a limit switch to their breakaway to stop the machine. Now that'd be the berries.

Allen

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by tnbndr » Tue Feb 17, 2015 9:10 am

I remember reading about someone adding a limit switch to their breakaway to stop the machine. Now that'd be the berries.
That is exactly how mine is set up from LDR. See limit switch at top of break away plate in photo.

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by steel 35 » Tue Feb 17, 2015 10:56 am

For the switch I have read hook up to the Z home, at this point it gives a e stop when a open happens. I thought the switch was the second part of a touch height start ? I have a ways to go but still moving forward, sometimes!

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by _Ogre » Tue Feb 17, 2015 11:47 am

tnbndr wrote:
I remember reading about someone adding a limit switch to their breakaway to stop the machine. Now that'd be the berries.
That is exactly how mine is set up from LDR. See limit switch at top of break away plate in photo.
i should look into doing this also
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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by TJS » Tue Feb 17, 2015 2:16 pm

I just got through making a breakaway set up see it in my build (link on signature). I have also wondered how to get the system into E-stop mode when the torch pops off. I am now going to add a mini momentary switch on a bracket that will reside on the metal permanent part of the breakaway set up I made. Then add a tab to the top edge of the aluminum plate where the actual torch mounts. Wish I could have originally made the tab for this on the machined aluminum plate, but this is kind of an after thought. Hopefully it will not look to cobbled when I am done. I have to play around with a couple designs in my head.
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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by SeanP » Tue Feb 17, 2015 2:31 pm

I have been using a homemade mag breakaway since building the table 2yrs ago now, torch is still the same one after all the learning and silly mistakes (which still do happen) so I would say it's worth it.

I don't have any home or limit switches on X, Y or the Z, just the floating head switch, seem to manage just fine, come up against the hard stops a few times but not very often now.

I usually get to the keyboard quick enough if something goes wrong to stop things, a lot of the time the torch will clip back into position with the magnets and carry on cutting from a small tip up, sometimes get away with it as well!

To date I think it's only completely dislocated the torch from the gantry once.

I normally have 'Torch off on arc loss' ticked, it doesn't run for long before shutting off, in fact I trim off sheets using that and the jog button,,,,edge start the cut at cut height, thc kicks in after chosen delay,,,,run off sheet edge and torch shuts off.

I never loose position, I would be using the escape key in emergency as well (no e stop switch on mine :o )

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I just used these brackets for the torch holder,,,,perfect fit on the Powermax 45 torch.

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by Metriccar » Tue Feb 17, 2015 3:35 pm

<I>I normally have 'Torch off on arc loss' ticked, it doesn't run for long before shutting off</I>

Is that in Mach 3? I'll have to see if Plasmacam has something similar.

I went to a magnetic breakaway on a Plasmacam, the magnet is not particularly strong. It WILL come off every once in a while, and I'll be a good 20 feet away from the machine and have to go over to it, the gantry will be moving still, and that torch just blasting away still rolling around on the table. Not a good thing at all.

For the Plasmacam, the carriage is held on with springs, so it really doesn't need a magnetic breakaway all that much... but I did not like the machine torch mount they offer.

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by SeanP » Tue Feb 17, 2015 4:35 pm

Sorry that's in Sheetcam, Candcnc's addition as well.
I normally have 'Torch off on arc loss' ticked, it doesn't run for long before shutting off</I>

Is that in Mach 3? I'll have to see if Plasmacam has something similar
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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by suttoncnc » Tue Feb 17, 2015 5:35 pm

When I made mine (break-away) I set it up to have a micro-switch in series with the e-stop circuit. When the torch falls off it stops motion and shuts off the torch. This brings up and interesting question-probably for Tom? Because the steppers remain powered during an e-stop with the DTHCII does Mach actually lose any steps and or position? My old control system would disable the motor coils and the motors would lose there holding torque, but the new does not. I have always re-homed the system after an e-stop but now I wonder do I have to? Sorry for the hi-jack.

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by jimcolt » Wed Feb 18, 2015 8:37 am

Plasma cutting on a cnc machine will eventually result in some collisions with the material being cut....or even with edges of the cutting table, tools left on the table, etc. It is inevitable. It is relatively easy to bend, break or crack the torch if it is rigidly mounted, and that will shut you down and cost money.

Torch breakaways are definitely a money and time saver in my book. It allows for quick consumable changes and end of torch inspection (necessary) without unclamping or unbolting a rigid mounted torch.

It is relatively easy to wire in some sort of stop switch to a breakaway that can stop the plasma arc, which on many machines will immediately stop motion as well. I strongly suggest the breakaway and a stop switch on every cnc plasma machine.

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by East German » Wed Feb 18, 2015 8:48 am

Hallo


I have a microswitch on the Magnetic breakaway switch make in Mach pauses.
This is better than reset. No step error

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by TJS » Wed Feb 18, 2015 9:49 am

East German wrote:Hallo


I have a microswitch on the Magnetic breakaway switch make in Mach pauses.
This is better than reset. No step error

Regards Peter
East German,
Can you post pics of that set up with the micro switch please.
Thanks.
T.J.

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by East German » Thu Feb 19, 2015 3:19 am

Hallo TJ

I'm doing morning pictures.
have to work today :twisted:

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by East German » Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:21 am

Hallo,

Port& Pins Input Signal........OEM Trig......select a free Input Pin (see Pic)

Config....System Hotkeys.....External button..........1001 Pauses
1000 Start
1007 zero All
1021 Reset
160 Regen Toolpath


Hope This Helps!

Regards Peter

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by Capstone » Wed Apr 01, 2015 6:57 am

Peter, that's a really smart way to take advantage of the software tool most of us use with Sheetcam. Thanks for sharing this solution.

I just upgraded my Bladerunner DTHC II to the latest DTHC IV and actually started to use this feature. It seemed to be working well, but I guess I didn't have the voltage set correctly and the TM45 Machine Torch dived&dragged.

I was not happy to see this happen!
Image

SO... now I have to make a magnetic breakaway with a microswitch shutoff. I think this is only a $60 mistake (for the outer sleeve housing) so I guess I got away semi-cheap. Mike G (OldSarge), I'm definitely copying your design. Thanks for sharing this really well designed setup with us on YouTube
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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by SeanP » Wed Apr 01, 2015 7:56 am

That's a sickener!
You look to have the torch mounted quite high up, maybe mounting with the z lower down might help a little also, breakaway is the answer thoug.
I bet you could re-use the larger part of the outer tube, I know I looked inside once and thought I could get away with cutting the outer tube in half and shortening the torch.
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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by Capstone » Wed Apr 01, 2015 12:24 pm

SeanP wrote:That's a sickener!
You look to have the torch mounted quite high up, maybe mounting with the z lower down might help a little also, breakaway is the answer thoug.
I bet you could re-use the larger part of the outer tube, I know I looked inside once and thought I could get away with cutting the outer tube in half and shortening the torch.
Yeah, I inspected the tube as well and where it cracked might have saved the rest of the important bits of the torch. All that was near was a few wires and an air hose which were left unscathed. I've already ordered a new tube, so I'll have the bad one with which to possibly experiment on shortening it.
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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by WyoGreen » Wed Apr 01, 2015 12:46 pm

You can take a longer tube and cut it exactly in half and make a mini machine torch. You just have to drill 3 holes on the cut end and you're back in business. I did this on my HT45 machine torch and everything fit back together just fine.

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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by Capstone » Wed Apr 01, 2015 6:01 pm

WyoGreen wrote:You can take a longer tube and cut it exactly in half and make a mini machine torch. You just have to drill 3 holes on the cut end and you're back in business. I did this on my HT45 machine torch and everything fit back together just fine.

Steve
You didn't have to shorten any of the internal parts like the air line??
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Re: Magnetic breakaway and settings

Post by steel 35 » Wed Apr 01, 2015 6:42 pm

WyoGreen wrote:You can take a longer tube and cut it exactly in half and make a mini machine torch. You just have to drill 3 holes on the cut end and you're back in business. I did this on my HT45 machine torch and everything fit back together just fine.

Steve
With the Feather touch sensor nearby is this this best way to wire it? Pull the jumper and its a prewired limit switch, right?
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