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GOME
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Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by GOME » Sun Apr 24, 2022 3:47 am

I mainly do metal art, smaller pieces, but had a friend opening up an espresso shop that wanted some unique signs made....did that job, even built the deck but now he wants benches for the deck. I finally decided this would be the project I'd just a fab table...so I have a 24 x 48 certiflat on the way. I made this leap because my next project is building him all steel benches like the one one picture without the wood. BLUF: Looking for advice on clamps I should purchase as my get me started package. Second...looking at the design of this table...I was thinking 2x2 square tube for the arm/leg structure, 1/8 wall. for the seat frame I was thinking 1.5" square tube again 1/8 wall. The slats will span 4 feet...and am torn between .063 and .12 for the 1x3 tubes I want to act as the seat and back. It's a shot in the dark...I normally operate nuclear powerplants, or turn wood bowls, this adventure is foreign to me, but I see why yalll are attracted to the pursuit. Thanks for any help or suggestions ...I'll post pictures.

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acourtjester
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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by acourtjester » Sun Apr 24, 2022 9:55 am

Hi Gome
I have the 24 x 48 certiflat table top you ordered good choice, here are a few clamps I made for it. There are many examples on YouTube with different types of clamps for table is 5/8" holes. Some buy HF "F" clamps and cut off one end and weld a bolt to it (to attach to the table top), foe an adjustable height clamp. If that was you in the video, buy a band saw your lungs will thank you. And buy a DC tig welder so much less grinding of the joints. Have fun
Tom

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DIY 4X4 Plasma/Router Table
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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by adbuch » Mon Apr 25, 2022 12:35 am

acourtjester wrote:
Sun Apr 24, 2022 9:55 am
Hi Gome
I have the 24 x 48 certiflat table top you ordered good choice, here are a few clamps I made for it. There are many examples on YouTube with different types of clamps for table is 5/8" holes. Some buy HF "F" clamps and cut off one end and weld a bolt to it (to attach to the table top), foe an adjustable height clamp. If that was you in the video, buy a band saw your lungs will thank you. And buy a DC tig welder so much less grinding of the joints. Have fun
Tom
Tom - that is a nice setup and great job on the clamps. I did the same thing using HF F-clamps. At the time, the HF clamps were only $20 each compared to the similar ones at Home Depot that cost $50 each. Here are some photos of mine.

I used 5/8" round steel pins welded into the larger sleeves at one end, and the end of the clamp post welded into the other end of the sleeve. My Rhino Carts have tops with 5/8" round holes that the pins fit into.

Tom - what was your reason for using bolts instead of pins on the end of your clamps? I assume you used the bolts for ease of fabrication of your clamps. I think if you welded 5/8" round pins to the ends of the clamps (instead of threaded bolts) then you wouldn't need nuts to retain the clamps in place. But perhaps you have another reason for your method. Please elaborate.

Thanks,


David
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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by adbuch » Mon Apr 25, 2022 1:25 am

Gome - Tom has shown some nice diy clamps, and suggested the ones like I built as well. Are you planning to purchase clamps (turn-key), or fabricating your own? I have several of the Strong Hand Tools Rhino Carts which use a grid of 5/8" round holes. Other than the diy clamps I have shown above, most of mine I ordered directly from Trick Tools and are the Strong Hand brand.

My Rhino Carts came with very basic tooling packages, and I purchased additional clamps and tooling separately to enhance my capabilities.

The number and style of clamps, blocks, pins, etc. that you acquire will depend to a great extent on the jobs you plan to do with your new fixturing table.

Killstressdesigns has a nice series of demo videos showing some of the applications for the different clamps, tooling, and fixturing. I watched most of his videos several times before I purchased my additional tooling. He works with both steel and wood and shows many valuable techniques, so these videos are well worth a look.

David





My Rhino Cart - 30" x 48" top
rhino cart.jpg


Alignment pins - these are very useful for fixturing parts at right angles or parallel to each other.
Pins for alignment.jpg
Pins for alignment 1.jpg
Vice grip style clamps
vice grip style clamps.jpg
Rhino clamps.jpg

Post clamps
post clamps.jpg

Some of my fixturing accessories
Rhino fixturing.jpg
Rhino fixturing 1.jpg

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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by adbuch » Mon Apr 25, 2022 1:34 am

Gome - Tom makes a great point about using a Tig welder for more precision work. I use both mig and tig here in the shop, but I will show you and example of some fixturing I made for my cnc plasma table. These slide over the cutting grates to support smaller items, straps, etc. for cutting.

You can see from the photos some of the various clamps, blocks, pins, etc. that I used to align and hold these parts for welding.

David
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1.jpg
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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by adbuch » Mon Apr 25, 2022 1:37 am

And here are the finished fixtures. These are very handy for holding flat strap and other smaller items securely to the table grates and in alignment for cutting and/or engraving. Note: This a Plasmacam table using stock cutting grates with water tray below grates, and it has additional draft system for extracting smoke and fumes from the shop.
David
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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by acourtjester » Mon Apr 25, 2022 9:08 am

David I used the 5/8" bolts as it was simpler and the table top is not as thick. Mt thought was it make them more stable with a nut on the under side. I just machined off the grade mark on the tops of the bolts before welding. Nice set of clamping tools.
DIY 4X4 Plasma/Router Table
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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by adbuch » Thu Apr 28, 2022 6:36 am

Tom - thanks for that! I was curious of the method of just sliding the pins into the holes would work for thinner table tops. But I do see some with thickness of 1/4" which do offer tooling with slip-fit pins instead of threaded studs/nuts. The only downside I see to your method is more time required to reach under the table and install the nuts. On the Rhino carts, not all holes are readily accessible from the underside of the table surface.

By the way, I made one with a 3/4" pin to fit in the hole on my welding table. I originally drilled a 3/4" hole thru the top when I constructed the table to facilitate lifting the top plate out of the truck. I installed an Eye Bolt and used an overhead hoist to lift it. Table is about 3' x 7' and 1 inch thick, so close to 1000 lbs.

David

This is the table.
table.jpg

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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by acourtjester » Thu Apr 28, 2022 10:11 pm

your shop is bigger than mine :Sad :Like
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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by tinspark » Fri Apr 29, 2022 1:51 am

adbuch wrote:
Thu Apr 28, 2022 6:36 am
Tom - thanks for that! I was curious of the method of just sliding the pins into the holes would work for thinner tabletops. But I do see some with thickness of 1/4" which do offer tooling with slip-fit pins instead of threaded studs/nuts. The only downside I see to your method is more time required to reach under the table and install the nuts. On the Rhino carts, not all holes are readily accessible from the underside of the table surface.

By the way, I made one with a 3/4" pin to fit in the hole on my welding table. I originally drilled a 3/4" hole thru the top when I constructed the table to facilitate lifting the top plate out of the truck. I installed an Eye Bolt and used an overhead hoist to lift it. Table is about 3' x 7' and 1 inch thick, so close to 1000 lbs.

David

This is the table.

table.jpg
I am close to buying a mag drill and just drilling 5/8" holes in 1/2", 3/8", or even 1/4" hot Roll plate to accommodate the various and assorted fixture tools, and attaching to the top of my existing aluminum I-Beam welding table, that I built a few years back. I noticed Evolution has an
1-5/8" mag drill that I have been kicking the tires about now for a few months..
https://store.evolutionpowertools.com/c ... s/evomag42
Doug,
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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by adbuch » Fri Apr 29, 2022 2:21 am

Doug - that looks like a nice drill at a very reasonable price. I've got a Hougen mag drill I bought about 4 years ago that looks similar in size to the Evolution. What I really like about mine is the annular cutters for drilling holes - much more efficient than a regular drill bit with more precision. These annular cutters make some really nice accurate round holes. I like them so much that I bought their R8 adapter so I can use these same cutters on my Bridgeport.

Depending on the work you do, it may (or may not) be important to keep all your hole on a precise grid so that the center lines of the rows and columns of holes are pretty much exactly perpendicular to each other. For simple clamping - it may not matter. But if you intend to fixture up assemblies where you will rely on pins in the holes for creating 90 degree joints and keeping edges of box frames parallel to each other, then it is more important. So in that case, it will be very important to lay out your grid accurately and position your drill bit or cutter exactly centered on each location center mark.

David

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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by tinspark » Fri Apr 29, 2022 2:53 am

adbuch wrote:
Fri Apr 29, 2022 2:21 am
Doug - that looks like a nice drill at a very reasonable price. I've got a Hougen mag drill I bought about 4 years ago that looks similar in size to the Evolution. What I really like about mine is the annular cutters for drilling holes - much more efficient than a regular drill bit with more precision. These annular cutters make some really nice accurate round holes. I like them so much that I bought their R8 adapter so I can use these same cutters on my Bridgeport.

Depending on the work you do, it may (or may not) be important to keep all your hole on a precise grid so that the center lines of the rows and columns of holes are pretty much exactly perpendicular to each other. For simple clamping - it may not matter. But if you intend to fixture up assemblies where you will rely on pins in the holes for creating 90 degree joints and keeping edges of box frames parallel to each other, then it is more important. So in that case, it will be very important to lay out your grid accurately and position your drill bit or cutter exactly centered on each location center mark.

David
I was thinking about springing on their annular drill set as well.
The drill bit chuck that comes with the drill is not the best. That is about all that I can find wrong with it pre-purchase, based on some of teh reviews.
Good reviews on their 1-1/8" mag drill though
https://store.evolutionpowertools.com/c ... /cc12set-2
Doug,
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Hypertherm 45XP-
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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by adbuch » Fri Apr 29, 2022 2:58 am

Those look like they would be interchangeable with the Hougen annular cutters. The shank looks to be the same. The set costs more than the drill, so perhaps just buy the cutters as you need them. Unless you are like me and you need to have every size "just-in-case".
David

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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by adbuch » Fri Apr 29, 2022 3:02 am

I just checked on Amazon and the Hougen 5/8" diamater x 1" depth of cut annular cutter is about $35. You might just start out with a single 5/8" cutter, or maybe you will need several of them depending on how many holes and the material thickness you will be drilling. I think hot rolled is probably harder on cutters than cold rolled, so something to consider.
David
annular cutter 0.625 inch.jpg

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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by adbuch » Fri Apr 29, 2022 4:20 am

acourtjester wrote:
Thu Apr 28, 2022 10:11 pm
your shop is bigger than mine :Sad :Like
But you probably get more work done!
David

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Re: Trolling for some Pro Trips

Post by tinspark » Fri Apr 29, 2022 7:10 am

adbuch wrote:
Fri Apr 29, 2022 3:02 am
I just checked on Amazon and the Hougen 5/8" diamater x 1" depth of cut annular cutter is about $35. You might just start out with a single 5/8" cutter, or maybe you will need several of them depending on how many holes and the material thickness you will be drilling. I think hot rolled is probably harder on cutters than cold rolled, so something to consider.
David

annular cutter 0.625 inch.jpg
:Like :Like :Like :Like
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+ myriads of shop toys **CAUTION**- "Does Not Play Well With Others" :)

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