Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

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abmetal
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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by abmetal » Sat Jan 18, 2014 8:10 am

ryno fab wrote:No comment in the PEX huh? you can buy a 100' roll for 25 bucks. The fittings are inexpensive and a ring crimp tool is about 30 bucks. Remains flexible in cold weather. Rated for 300 psi. the stuff is made to go in concrete.... its tough. I have had 190psi in it at -40F and hit it with a hammer trying to get it to blow.... just to make sure. Its easy to add new lines or re-rout. you can even re-use the fittings. I would recommend the brass fittings.

For me, Pex sounds like the way to go. I'll need more volume than the 1/2" air line will provide and it's a heck of a lot cheaper than copper. I like copper for the fact that it dissipates the heat more than anything else but the cost is a killer.

Allen

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by MIFab » Sun Jan 19, 2014 9:42 am

I know this post is kinda old but after seeing the post that people are going to use pex, black pipe, pvc or copper I just had to share I have a 20 by 20 shop and went with this kit it took me a day to install this by my self https://www.rapidairproducts.com/maxline_masterkits.asp . By the time you guys get the fittings and pipes you might as well get this system it will be cheaper in the long run and its as easy as cut and click to add to the system !

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by CNCCAJUN » Sun Jan 19, 2014 11:14 am

Have looked at it also, but was afraid it would have that special smell you get with Chinese Plastic.

Like walking into Harbor Freight and taking a deep breath.

Does the MAXLINE Product have that odor of bonded recycled plastic?

It looks like a great product, I just know that if it has the Chinese plastic smell it will not work . . . :(

Thanks for the update,
Steve
Smiling Gator Metal Works, LLC
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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by MIFab » Sun Jan 19, 2014 11:52 am

No smell and it is professional looking I have to pressure regulators / water separators on it the main one takes out the water but I added the 2nd one over where my plasma cutter is and I never see water in the bowl. I'll take a video today and post it . If there were a demand for it I would go into sale and insulation of the product it is awesome ! I know in my area Menards sells it for those that dont like to buy off the net.

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CNCCAJUN
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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by CNCCAJUN » Sun Jan 19, 2014 12:33 pm

Did you set the page for the straightening jig on their site?

It was cool . . .

Steve
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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by MIFab » Sun Jan 19, 2014 12:49 pm

I did everything by hand I suppose it would of cut down on install time

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by ryno fab » Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:13 pm

Pex is the hydronic tubing you put in concrete floors for heated slab. You can buy a crimper for 25 bucks. Home Depot or Lows. I have had mine in use for over a year. I used 3/4 inch and I get plenty of volume. I wouldn't use 1/2. Also it doesnt get brittle in the cold. It gets a little stiff but I pulled all mine into my walls then it was -20f.

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by abmetal » Fri Feb 21, 2014 10:52 pm

ryno fab,

I was looking at the Pex tubing in Menards today and the Pex tubing's rating was much less than 300 psi. The ratings were 160 psi @ 73 degrees Fahrenheit, 100 psi @ 180 degrees Fahrenheit, and 80 psi @ 200 degrees Fahrenheit. And the Pex tubing was made by Nibco. What's the brand name of the Pex you were referring to? I'd rather use Pex when I build my shop but the rating of the tubing here is too low.

Allen

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by MIFab » Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:22 pm

abmetal wrote:ryno fab,

I was looking at the Pex tubing in Menards today and the Pex tubing's rating was much less than 300 psi. The ratings were 160 psi @ 73 degrees Fahrenheit, 100 psi @ 180 degrees Fahrenheit, and 80 psi @ 200 degrees Fahrenheit. And the Pex tubing was made by Nibco. What's the brand name of the Pex you were referring to? I'd rather use Pex when I build my shop but the rating of the tubing here is too low.

Allen

With the cost of fittings and what not and the value of safety I would only use what is safe! I did not want to be out in my shop and think about pieces going everywhere due to my air lines exploding !

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by CNCCAJUN » Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:41 pm

It looks like I am going to go the MAXLINE route . . . some of the guys on here have had really good luck with it.

Too old to be wrestling 3/4" black iron pipe all over a shop.

Have a Quincy 7.5 (for low vibration) & a (no after cooler on compressor)high temp dryer.

If I can ever finish the 10,000 other things I need to do to make ready my metal building I will to get the MAXLINE installed.

I have been told by the compressor gurus where I bought mine that everything last longer & less problems if you keep oil & water out of your piping system. Also bleed your entire system down every night when you close shop.

I surely will remember all the work to set up the shop when I am quoting prices . . . :D

Steve
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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by MIFab » Sun Feb 23, 2014 12:41 am

When I bought my maxline I also bought two regs/separators one coming off the lead out of the compressor the my line goes up the wall to a T then along the ceiling and to my first quick disconnect/ drain. Go back to the T then along the ceiling to another T that goes down the center of the garage to an QD/drain. Back to the T along the back of garage to the other side of the garage down the wall to the 2 reg/ separator I have yet to seeanything in this one. I have a 24x24 garage and after I got it all setup I had about 8ft of the tube left over.

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by VSAW » Fri Feb 28, 2014 8:44 am

You can also run DOT brake line used in big trucks. They have PTC (push to connect) fittings and it handles plenty of pressure. I have PVC in my shop now but it's temporary until I build my new building this summer.

The trick to PVC is not to use thread tape on fittings. tightening them too tight causes them to crack. Much better to use a gasket sealer like one with copper in it. Then always use brass fittings so there is no rust. You can get line clamps (for electrical pvc) in the electrical area of any home store.

Then anywhere you need to drop down to a connector always use a T with a valve at the end to collect and dump water.

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by abmetal » Fri Feb 28, 2014 10:05 am

I ran PVC air lines in a friend's tire shop...that's what he wanted, and there were several "blow outs" over a 1-2 year period. The pvc would swell up like a ball and pop like a gun, and it was always at a glued connection. It's been a year or so since it last happened last so I'm hoping that's it. My thoughts are that the glue probably softened the plastic enough to cause it. I tried to get him to agree to using copper but he didn't want the expense. He now knows why.

Allen

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by VSAW » Fri Feb 28, 2014 11:34 am

abmetal wrote:I ran PVC air lines in a friend's tire shop...that's what he wanted, and there were several "blow outs" over a 1-2 year period. The pvc would swell up like a ball and pop like a gun, and it was always at a glued connection. It's been a year or so since it last happened last so I'm hoping that's it. My thoughts are that the glue probably softened the plastic enough to cause it. I tried to get him to agree to using copper but he didn't want the expense. He now knows why.

Allen
You used the wrong stuff. I have been working in shops with pvc since 1980 and never saw it blow up like a ballon. The only failures I have seen are from improperly glued connections and split ends from steel or other hard fittings being screwed in too far. I have also seen failures where line was not secured to a pole or to a wall.

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by abmetal » Fri Feb 28, 2014 3:53 pm

By "wrong stuff" do you mean the glue? Because I double checked to make sure I had the right kind before I started gluing.

I was in Menards today and noticed that they have schedule 80 pvc that's rated over 600 psi. I didn't even know they made sch. 80 pvc.

Allen

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by CNCCAJUN » Fri Feb 28, 2014 5:42 pm

I realize not everyone is going to agree, and that is OK. I will not get into the argument about how safe or unsafe it is to use PVC for air lines. What I can tell you is this, whatever material you deem will to be safe, you better have supporting documentation from a the manufacturer stating that it can be used in that application. I don't care if it is schedule 80 or better.

From a liability standpoint the manufacturer will stand behind his product as stated. There is misconception amongst people in these workshop forums that if a piece of PVC has a test pressure of 600 PSIG that 175 PSIG should be no problem.

The 600 PSIG is a statement of quality, not a CONTINUOUS use safe WORKING pressure. There are many factors that can affect the integrity of PVC beyond high pressure. There is it's degradation due to oil, high air temperature, sunlight, UV from welding, high and low ambient temperatures. Then there are the dangers of impact damage that could burst or just weaken the line. That could include hits from tools or equipment.

Then there are the overspray possibilities. Something as simple as spray paint will change the structure of the PVC. If you don't believe it, read any hard hat, it states clearly DO NOT PAINT. If you are caught on an industrial jobsite with a painted hard hat by a savvy safety man you will have to replace immediately. A scaffolding company in our area decided to paint all their hard hats with LSU colors. EXXON safety did not like it. The OSHA guy liked it even less.

Just a side note, if have witnessed failures on PVC, most will probably be near the fittings, you know the fittings and the end of the pipe you SOAKED with a PVC solvent that allows the two pieces to bond. PVC is not GLUED, it becomes bonded when the surfaces to be connected become SOFT from the solvent. PVC glue has no real adhesive qualities.

Should a line blow and injure anyone I can assure you an insurance inspector will be visiting you. He will dance a jig when he sees your blown PVC compressed air lines. You will learn a new term, CONTRIBUTORY NEGLIGENCE.

So for me it's black iron, copper approved for compressed air or one of the newer products like MAXLINE, or the pretty blue hard aluminum now offered by just about everyone.

My thoughts on this are based on working in a PVC plant and listening to the engineers spar over this at least once a week.

My 2 cents,
Steve
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abmetal
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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by abmetal » Fri Feb 28, 2014 6:55 pm

No argument outa' me. That's what I like about Plasmaspider......information. And many thanks for it.

Allen

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Re: Compressed Air Lines - building a new shop

Post by odha » Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:18 pm

I know this is an old post - just wanted to add another vote for the RapidAir Maxline. We installed it in our school shop in 2011 and it has held up very well. System was originally put together with a standard white pipe dope - we had some leaks. Reassembled with the blue monster pipe dope and has been working great ever since.

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