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PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

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PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby Joe Jones » Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:35 pm

UPDATE - 09/21/2017 PlasmaCam has shipped both machines and I have tracking numbers. If all goes well, they should be here on the 26th. Of course, some mad scientist predicts that the world will END tomorrow, September 23rd, so ... :lol:

UPDATE - 09/18/2017 PlasmaCam has HONORED their sale of these two machines at the agreed price! They probably weren't happy about it, and I cannot be sure what changed their minds, but I suspect it was either their own lawyers, the eBay lawyers, or a missive from the Attorney General of Colorado, Cynthia Hoffman. :mrgreen:

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PlasmaCam is playing games, and really pissing off table owners, as you may know.

Well, they just RAISED the price of their GoTorch (2x2 machine) by $1,000.00 JUST to spite ONE owner who already has ONE GoTorch and two seats with software upgrades.

He tried to buy a second GoTorch machine as a "bare bones" table for parts, and PlasmaCam demanded that he pay AGAIN for MATCHING software upgrades on table #2 so he cannot use his enhanced second seat of table #1 to run the second table. They do not want him to use the advanced software features of table #1 on the second table without paying for them AGAIN!

THEN they contacted him and told him they were (conveniently) "out of stock" on Go Torch machines, so they would refund his money, and oh ... maybe he could order the Go Torch later (at the higher price, of course.)

So I went to the GoTorch site, and SURE ENOUGH, they raised the price of the GoTorch by $1,000.00

So I checked eBay, where they were selling the GoTorch for the OLD price of $2,995.00 + shipping ($3,495.00) SOMEONE forgot to change the price on the eBay listings! They listed TWO GoTorch machines for the OLD price, so being the wild and crazy guy that I am ... I BOUGHT BOTH OF THEM!

I cannot WAIT to hear the scuttlebutt ... "Mr. Bulle ... Good news ... and BAD news ... We sold two Go Torches on eBay last night, but ... well ... that $%&*@ JOE JONES bought BOTH OF THEM ... and at the OLD PRICE! Now he has FIVE tables, and NINE 'Full Monte seats with every upgrade we offer!"

If PlasmaCam does not honor these two sales, I will become a huge problem for them. I will get eBay on their ass for using them as a FREE ADVERTISING site without EVER selling a machine on eBay (so eBay and PayPal get no sales commission for the auction listings), and I explore every legal remedy.

WATCH my Facebook page and the Owners Community. I suspect SOMEONE at PlasmaCam will be fired tomorrow, Inline image and I suspect PlasmaCam will try to back out of their eBay sales.

My Facebook Group: PlasmaCam / Samson 510 / DesignEDGE Users Group

Now I can go MOBILE with these machines to make stuff on the fly at shows! Not by using a plasma cutter, but using a router and a laser.

I think PlasmaCam is going to send a sniper to Kentucky!

UPDATE: PlasmaCam immediately canceled the sales and refunded my money, claiming they are "out of stock". That doesn't matter, as I am willing to wait for the machines, and that is NO EXCUSE to cancel the sales.

SHAME ON PLASMACAM for their unscrupulous and dishonest business practices.

http://youtu.be/gY6A3NzjGLA

Joe
Last edited by Joe Jones on Fri Sep 22, 2017 10:17 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby little blue choo » Tue Sep 12, 2017 11:57 pm

Sound pretty shady to me. With all the complaints I've been hearing about their business practices you would think they were trying to ruin their own name. Just my 2 cents.

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby gamble » Wed Sep 13, 2017 12:06 am

Shady as shit
Guess I will cross them off my list for when I upgrade. So ya that's one sale they just lost
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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby Old Iron » Thu Sep 14, 2017 5:20 am

Me too
I was just about to pull the trigger till now. Thx

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby Capstone » Thu Sep 14, 2017 8:27 am

When I first starting looking into CNC Plasma Tables, obviously PlasmaCam was the first one that sent me a cheezy super UV coated slick catalog. That's how they get you. The tables never looked stable or accurate to me, so I built my own. More importantly, I knew that the real hook was the software that drove the table, and I quickly saw that PlasmaCAM owners were on their own little island of misfit toys; never quite able to play nice with the rest of the community.


Sorry to hear you're embroiled in this mess, but why would you double down and even try to give them more money?!
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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby Joe Jones » Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:03 am

[video removed]
Last edited by Joe Jones on Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby rdj357 » Thu Sep 14, 2017 10:00 am

Capstone wrote:More importantly, I knew that the real hook was the software that drove the table, and I quickly saw that PlasmaCAM owners were on their own little island of misfit toys; never quite able to play nice with the rest of the community.


I can see how this thread can and likely will turn into a bash PlasmaCAM (and apparently by extension, their owners) but let me clear a few things up. Their tables are in fact good quality. Despite the rah rah crowd claiming a bolt together table is cheap and chincy compared to their homemade iron fortresses their table is quite capable of full sheets of thick material. There is a member here who regularly cuts 3/4 and 1" material on his 5x10 table. Despite the 'island of misfit toys' rant about the software, I'm able to use it and help many people right here on PlasmaSpider.

Please go both barrels on their shady, unacceptable, vile, childish, ignorant business practices. They've earned it. They got a little excited in their piecemeal software market by overpricing upgrades and being secretive about what those upgrades actually do. They lose credibility by leaps and bounds when they show that glossy book and video but neglect to inform their customers just what upgrades must be purchased to accomplish what's shown in the ad. They have decades long history of poor business practices and sketchy support. Business wise it is obvious that their rise to popularity was due to their being innovative at the right time in history. That day has passed and now they are a money hungry, desperate company that desperately needs to hire a business adviser and marketing strategist if they have a shred of hope at competing in the current market.

I'm perfectly happy with my PlasmaCAM (Samson) machine in its performance and reliability. I am perfectly happy with the software that is an easy to use CAD program with integrated CAM. Were I to go back in time 5 years when I got this table knowing what I know now I'd likely do it again. Today I guarantee I would build my own or look to Wescott, JD2, or the like simply because I wouldn't hitch my wagon to the assholes at PlasmaCAM that insist they're gods in the market and would worry about their continued ability to operate.
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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby see&see » Thu Sep 14, 2017 12:51 pm

Capstone wrote:When I first starting looking into CNC Plasma Tables, obviously PlasmaCam was the first one that sent me a cheezy super UV coated slick catalog. That's how they get you. The tables never looked stable or accurate to me, so I built my own. More importantly, I knew that the real hook was the software that drove the table, and I quickly saw that PlasmaCAM owners were on their own little island of misfit toys; never quite able to play nice with the rest of the community.


I'd have to say that your cognitive thought, deductive reasoning, and situational awareness are simply written to piss people off. Zero reality, zero substantive meaning and not a clue as to what you are talking about.. Why bash the members here fella, uh???
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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby motoguy » Fri Sep 15, 2017 8:03 pm

Too many people I respect are using Plasmacam and Samson, and making good money and good product. I don't necessarily feel that the Plasmacam product is the best value out there, but it's certainly capable of the job. If I owned one, though, I'd always be worried when I might find myself boxed in a corner, and Plasmacam demands $$$$ to let me back out.

Some people view the all-in-one nature of DesignEdge as a selling point. Personally, I LIKE using dedicated, industry known programs (CorelDraw, Solidworks, Fusion360, etc) to do my drawings. I have the Plasma table, but also a vinyl cutter, CO2 laser on the way, 3d printers, and hope to pick up a 3D router. The very "all in one" that is such a selling point when you have only one piece of equipment, becomes a liability when you have several.

I'd much rather draw something up in Corel/Solidworks/Fusion, and import it to my machine/process of choice, vs learning to draw in my Plasma table software, then the vinyl cutter software, then the 3d printer software, etc.
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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby Metriccar » Sat Sep 16, 2017 3:07 am

This guy Joe Jones rattles on about how Plasmacam does everything wrong then goes and buys two additional machines from them. Do they must be doing something right otherwise he would have bought a wescott or something else right? Or did he just spend $6000 out of spite? DesignEdge is excellent software. The table construction is fine. The servo motors are great. Plasmacam has an excellent piece of equipment. Some people actually have one Plasmacam table and don't buy extra tables and there is absolutely no reason to buy additional tables for "spares" nor is there any reason to have spares unless it's springs, belts and maybe a few other cheap things totaling less than $100 and that's only if you're doing high volume production and can't afford 2 days downtime, which clearly he's not.

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby jimcolt » Sat Sep 16, 2017 7:36 am

I own more than one cnc plasma machine and have built 6 home made machines over my years plasma cutting. The machine that I have had in my home shop for over 12 years? A Plasmacam DHC2 (4 x 4) machine. It has cut thousands of feet of every thickness and type of material and has been extremely reliable. I upgraded to the advanced Design Edge software a number of years ago.....and it is among the easiest software to learn and use (and I have used a lot of them!). I have only had one issue with the machine in over 12 years and that was one of the drive motors failed (error code popped up on the screen saying the motor was shorted)....I read the manual which gave me detailed troubleshooting info, then ordered the motor on Plasmacams site...it arrived in 2 days and after installation I was back running.

Their method of doing business? Direct sales. Call them at their place in Colorado and give them your credit card and they will ship the machine to you. (why buy it on Ebay?) You get a detailed video manual that tells you how to assemble the machine, and tutorials on how to learn and use the software. They do have a tech service line if you have issues, though I hear it is a bit hard to get through (I have called them a number of times over the years and had no issues). There is also a an "owners community" on the Plasmacam website that is monitored by Plasmacam's tech service staff as well as hundreds (I don't know the exact number) of machine owners. If you have an issue or question post it on the community and you will get response and help from other owners that have the same equipment and software. There are parts pages on the website as well where you can order parts for your machine as well.

I guess if you really want the best level of support on a CNC cutting machine you could find better choices.....there are over 30 manufacturers of low cost (under $20k) cnc plasma machines in the USA and Canada. Some are lower in price than Plasmacam, some higher. One thing is for certain, no one has more cnc machines installed in the field than Plasmacam. They have been selling these machines for over 20 years.....with 3 major mechanical design changes as well as one major software upgrade (modular upgrades.....buy what you want) and many free software revisions.

My point? They are a good solid company with good products. I suspect their method of doing business is to help them keep up with the difficult task of keeping a huge installed base of machines/ customers happy and running. Other companies may have a few hundred or a thousand machines in the field, this one has over ten thousand in the field. Imagine the task of answering the tech service phones with a large installed base like that! That is where the Owners Community comes into play.

As far as the sales on Ebay that the original poster of this thread is upset about....who know what is going on there! I see no need to bash every aspect of the company and their products for it. I'd buy another of their machines in a second, no hesitation if I had the need for one. My experience with them has been good. I would (of course) shop around a bit as the choices for machines today are much larger than they were when I bought mine years ago. Jim Colt

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby see&see » Sat Sep 16, 2017 1:40 pm

Metriccar wrote:This guy Joe Jones rattles on about how Plasmacam does everything wrong then goes and buys two additional machines from them. Do they must be doing something right otherwise he would have bought a wescott or something else right? Or did he just spend $6000 out of spite? DesignEdge is excellent software.


Met,

I wouldn't read too much into what Joe wrote here without being familiar with the whole situation. Joe is fully supportive of PlasmaCam products as any of us would be. He's done many PlasmaCam instructional videos and posted them online as well as helping a lot of newcomers with the product.

His beef here is regarding a business action, possibly by lower management who sold and accepted hard money for two fairly pricey products on E-Bay and than obviously later made up a story about the reason for not supplying same after the fact. I suspect the actual PlasmaCam controlling owner knew nothing of this proceeding. I saw the auction myself and thought about doing the same thing myself as I noticed it was a good buy. When you sell on E-Bay as many of us do there is a strict set of rules, actually a contract you agree to and we are legally held to that contract if push comes to shove. Apparently, that wasn't followed in this case and more details will follow I'm sure.

A lot of what Joe does is "with tongue in cheek" and most folks that might at first reject a sense of humor find it a bit rash and I can understand that. Myself, I found Joe's video quite entertaining.. As for what Jim Colt wrote I agree fully...
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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby Metriccar » Sat Sep 16, 2017 6:14 pm

No trust me, I am fully aware of Joe Jones and his commentary. I'm sure everyone that owns a Plasmacam knows who he is by now.

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby see&see » Sat Sep 16, 2017 11:29 pm

Yea, that's nice, but I'm not wound up so tight I can't discount the OP's claim.

I had the same kind of situation happen with Zoro (Grainger/Drill Spot same company) but they were not under contract like PlasmaCam was on E-Bay to supply the press brake tooling I bought from them at a bargain 1 day "sale" price. A week later they hadn't shipped the item and I called to see what had happened. They told me the product was "not available" "out of stock" and said they would refund my credit card already charged. I called the company that makes the tooling, Edwards, and they had an excess of that size in stock and they drop ship for Zoro quite often. Of course I was lied to by Zoro and I have E-mail to prove it.

In the meantime I had a chance to save a thousand bucks on the same brake tooling from a guy that bought the same item and it was too wide to fit in his press. I had to turn it down at the time because I thought Zoro had already shipped the tooling. By the time I found out a week later that Zoro had marked the item up a few hundred bucks and changed the stock number it was too late.

I've posted Zoro's dishonest business practice many places on the net and turned them into several complaint data bases including the BBB.

Zoro would not honor their sale just like PlasmaCam. I can guarantee that unless business practice changes at PlasmaCam my next table will NOT be a PlasmaCam..
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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby bigcreek » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:07 am

Joe that video was frickin hilarious! :lol:

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby DXF » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:11 pm

While I have owned a Plasma Cam machine for over 15 years I understand their tactics to get the most $ for their products. No one is obligated to purchase their machines or software and other companies have offered excellent options to Plasma Cam. It's called competition. I loved the video!

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby little blue choo » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:35 pm

Love both videos Joe! The Hitler video was pure genius. Still laughing!

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby see&see » Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:02 am

That video is priceless! :lol: And it's exactly spot on!

They have now decided to send Joe the two machines for the E-Bay selling price.. :D

Joe Jones: UPDATE 09/19/2017 - PlasmaCam has HONORED my two eBay purchases of GoTorch machines at the old price of $2,995.00 + $500.00 shipping. I must give them credit for stepping up and doing the honorable thing. Thank you, PlasmaCam.

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby Bobkovacs » Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:34 am

see&see wrote:
Joe Jones: UPDATE 09/19/2017 - PlasmaCam has HONORED my two eBay purchases of GoTorch machines at the old price of $2,995.00 + $500.00 shipping. I must give them credit for stepping up and doing the honorable thing. Thank you, PlasmaCam.



I've just got to comment on this- "$500 shipping"? For a 2'x2' table? x2, I'm assuming? Good lord- they rape you every way they can! Unreal that people continue to pay their prices........

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby jimcolt » Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:54 am

The shipping sounds right for the size and weight as well as travel from Colorado to Kentucky. And the shipping cost is set by the trucking Co, not the plasma cnc machine builder.....FYI!

I shipped a 700 lb machine to Utah 2 years ago from NH, it cost over $1200. Jim Colt Hypertherm

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby see&see » Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:22 am

I agree, that shipping price is NOT high..

I turned a trucking business over to my son and the state and federal BS with costs has got to the point where it's almost impossible to buy trucks and hire drivers and stay afloat in business. Just for starters,12% truck excise tax on tires, parts, new trucks and trailers etc.. That only applies to commercial trucks not private vehicles and that's EXTRA tax on top of everything else.

I've found in this area, usually it's the people who vote for the liberal politician that raises our taxes are the first one's to complain about truck rates..

Now, lets look at the cost of boxing that PlasmaCam does so well. I've had two machines shipped without a scratch on any of the parts inside. In comparison I've had two Ellis bandsaws shipped and had excess of $500 damage on each shipment.. Three swamp coolers shipped and had to send two of them back for damage.. I could go on..
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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby jimcolt » Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:35 pm

Plasmacam does do a great packaging job. I bought a 50" pan brake from Grizzly about 6 months ago......weighed 1200 lbs. Very poor packaging and a lot of cosmetic damage (I made Grizzly take care of it...not the trucking company). Jim

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby little blue choo » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:35 pm

I purchased a 48" pan and box brake from Grzzly for appr. $600 and the shipping wasn't that bad. They charged me $109 from Washington state to North Carolina. It came inside a wooden crate with no damage. Guess I'm just lucky. LOL

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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby acourtjester » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:46 pm

The old story you can fool some of the people sometime, but not Joe :lol: :lol:
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Re: PlasmaCam RENEGES on eBay Sales

Postby Joe Jones » Wed Sep 20, 2017 12:06 am

Bobkovacs wrote:I've just got to comment on this- "$500 shipping"? For a 2'x2' table? x2, I'm assuming?


First, I will say this for the record: I LIKE the tables and I REALLY LIKE the software, even with all of the issues of seemingly endless .01 secret software updates (14 in the last nine months). Yes, they are FUN to use when they work, and a PITA when they don't.

I believe there are probably 60 more features that could be added to the software to make DesignEdge truly cutting edge, and put it worlds ahead of the other programs, but PlasmaCam seems reluctant to add new features. They have spent the last year on a Witch Hunt, looking for some Bozo who was offering to unlock the Full Monte for $1,000.00, and they have royally pissed off a segment of their paying customers in the process!

I wanted two more PlasmaCam tables in the 2x2 size so I could:

1. Go portable for car shows and craft fairs.

2. Have spare parts available for my three main tables.

3. Experiment with things like a low powered laser, paint pens, the PlasmaCam engraver I purchased, and perhaps other accessories that another person or company, or I myself have created or might create to run on a PlasmaCam table.

4. Use the GoTorch on existing surfaces to route a compass rose, or perhaps "Welcome to Our Home!" into hardwood floors at the entrances to homes and such, for the purpose of an inlay of a different wood, or a colored resin, or a stainless steel or polished copper inlay, or whatever. A regular PlasmaCam table would be nearly impossible to set up for that purpose.

For mobile shows, I would not use a plasma torch and a compressor. I'd set one up with a small router and the other one with a low powered red or blue laser for etching plastic and wood and foam blanks on the fly, all run off of a small Honda generator.

As for the $500.00 eBay shipping charge:

When you understand the bigger picture, you will understand why PlasmaCam set the shipping at $500.00 on eBay.

PlasmaCam has been playing a game with eBay for many years, using them for free advertising and for buyer recruitment. eBay can be abused for FREE INTERNATIONAL ADVERTISING!

eBay told me that up to and including MY attempt to purchase two GoTorch machines via the GoTorch eBay auctions, PlasmaCam has NEVER completed a GoTorch sale transaction through eBay.

When you advertise something on eBay you enter into a contract with them to HAVE that item ON HAND and ready to ship when the auction ends, or the BUY IT NOW option is exercised. You also agree to pay eBay 10% of the sale price, which would be $300.00 on a $2,995.00 GoTorch machine sale. So PlasmaCam added $360.00 to their normal $140.00 shipping charge ($360+ $140 = $500) to cover the eBay sales commission so THEY would not have to pay that $300 fee out of their pockets, and the additional $60.00 was to cover the 2% credit card processing fees. PlasmaCam wasn't about to pay EITHER of those out of their own pocket. Shifty? You decide.

The "GOTCHA!" is when someone "buys" a machine on eBay and gives them a DREADED credit card! When you buy something with a credit card, you have protections built into your purchase. If the GoTorch machine(s) arrived damaged, incomplete, broken, or not functional, or it was stolen off of my doorstep, or I was unhappy with them for ANY reason, the credit card company would go to bat for me, and refund my money and charge it back to PlasmaCam … and PlasmaCam WOULDN'T have ANY of THAT!

So every time a GoTorch was purchased through the eBay auction, PlasmaCam would tell eBay that the machine was "out of stock" or "damaged" or they would click on "Unable to Fulfill Order" and eBay would let them waltz away without paying any fees for luring in another GoTorch buyer.

PlasmaCam would then contact the "winning bidder" of the eBay GoTorch auction DIRECTLY, and point them to the GoTorch.com website, where the order form would let them buy the GoTorch immediately, with a promise of delivery in only a few business days.

On the GoTorch site, the shipping is "Only $140.00" so LOOK AT HOW MUCH MONEY YOU SAVED BY GOING DIRECTLY TO OUR WEBSITE! The customer would buy the machine for $2,995.00 + $140.00 shipping, and PlasmaCam would instruct them to send a Cashier's Check, a Money Order or wire the funds directly into PlasmaCam's account "for faster processing." The buyer would be unaware of the fact that they have unknowingly forfeited ANY option to recover their purchase price for ANY reason by NOT using a credit card.

So the $500.00 shipping charge" was an imaginary number that was never paid, because buyers would be redirected AWAY from eBay to buy the machines directly from the GoTorch.com website ... thereby cheating eBay out of their $300.00 sales commission for each machine sold, and cheating PayPal out of their credit card processing fees as well ...HUNDREDS of times over many years.

PlasmaCam did not even TRY to do this with ME, because they knew I was onto their game, and they did not want ME to have two more machines due to the fact that I have NINE "FULL MONTE" seats, additional DesignEdge seats that have EVERY option they offer, and those seats are installed onto computers that CAN be used to run ANY PlasmaCam table, including the two new GoTorch machines.

Unfortunately for them, an employee at PlasmaCam recently spilled the beans and announced publicly that additional seats CAN run other tables, when he tried to force another GoTorch owner to MATCH PURCHASE software upgrades for his second GoTorch machine. I discovered this shortly after buying my second table with only two upgrades on THAT DesignEdge license. I hooked up a Full Monte “seat” from table #1 to table #2 experimentally, and VIOLA! I had another fully functional PlasmaCam table.

Recent Bruh-ha-ha on the Owners Community and on my Facebook page has brought this whole DesignEdge licensing issue to a head. PlasmaCam INSISTS that your DE license can ONLY run the table bearing the serial number with which it was purchased. However, they seemed to think they could also demand that you ‘MATCH PURCHASE’ all upgrades for the DE License(s) sold with any additional table(s), and the LAW simply will not give them that omnipotent power. If you wish to buy upgrades for one table, you can do that. If you wish to purchase a second ‘Bare Bones’ machine, you can do that also.

PlasmaCam has ZERO authority to tell you that you must MATCH your software upgrades on additional machines. That would be like Home Depot telling you that you must purchase matching accessories for a second table saw, after you buy the Full Monte of accessories for your first table!

I kept this dirty, dark PlasmaCam secret for FIVE FULL YEARS, by repeatedly telling people that their software was absolutely tied to their table serial numbers and those additional seats could NOT run other tables. It was not my place to expose the lie, and I allowed PlasmaCam to keep it under wraps.

PlasmaCam must have thought they could force me to buy ALL of the software upgrades AGAIN for EACH GoTorch machine ... at some $30,000.00 total cost ... so that I would not use a Full Monte seat from my 510 table #1 to give my GoTorch machines additional capabilities that they claim I had not purchased. I think it is petty and GREEDY on the part of PlasmaCam to insist that one owner of several tables who is the sole operator of those tables must purchase identical software upgrades for EACH table at a cost of $1,000.00 per upgrade/per table. I have lawyers looking at this right now.

So they immediately refunded my money and canceled the eBay order of the two machines without a single WORD of explanation beyond telling eBay they were "out of stock or could not fulfill order" on the GoTorch machines. I know for a FACT that they are not “out of stock” on the GoTorch machines. They just did not want me to HAVE the machines without paying countless thousands of dollars for duplicate software upgrades.

There is a glaring lack of professionalism at PlasmaCam that really bothers me.

THIS is the E-mail I should have received from PlasmaCam on 9/12/2017:

“Dear Mr. Jones.

Thank you for being such a great PlasmaCam customer for the past five years. Our records show that you currently own THREE tables, two Samson 510 tables and one DHC2 4x4 table, and that you purchased tables #2 and #3 used. We have seen your YouTube training videos and also read with amusement, your sometimes heated and controversial participation in the Owners Community forum threads.

We know of your travels around America this past summer to train PlasmaCam table owners on how to use their tables and DesignEdge software so they can feel good about their table purchase and actually “Make Money In Metal Art!” as our slogan states.

We also received, and read with great interest, your generous proposal to invest $150,000.00 of your own money to build and run a PlasmaCam School at your home workshop by holding weekend training seminars on four Samson 510 tables and eight computer work stations. We regret that we declined to assist you in any way in that endeavor. In fact, we didn’t even acknowledge your offer, or consider participating in it’s success, even though we know that the seminars could have translated into additional table sales, software upgrades, and accessory sales, etc.

We are aware of the MANY thousands of dollars you have spent on software upgrades, additional seats, and a wide assortment of parts and accessories for your PlasmaCam tables, including the engraver and the pipe cutting attachment, additional gantry and carriage assemblies and more. We appreciate your continued business and loyalty to the PlasmaCam product line. We know you have other choices, and certainly the resources to move to another table manufacturer at any time.

We see that you just purchased two new GoTorch machines from our eBay auctions, which we were running during the time we had just raised the price of the GoTorch machine by $1,000.00 to $3,995.00 on our own gotorch.com website. The two eBay auctions we were running still listed those machines at $2,995.00 each. You were very keen and fortunate to have purchased both of them before we could change the price of those two machines on the eBay auctions. Congratulations on adding two more machines to you growing inventory of PlasmaCam tables! We look forward to a long and healthy business relationship with you.

You may not be aware of our recent reorganization efforts. We have temporarily ceased shipping the GoTorch machines due to a repackaging effort to reduce shipping costs, and provide more efficient service by streamlining our logistics. Regretfully, we cannot ship your two new GoTorch machines to you in a timely manner.

We are offering to refund your full purchase price to the two credit cards you used, so that you may use those available funds for other purposes. If you prefer, we will hold onto those funds, and notify you the moment your machines are ready to be shipped, but know that it may be several weeks before that may happen. Please reply ASAP with your preference. Of course, if we refund your money, we will honor the winning auction price of $2,995.00 each, plus $140.00 shipping each, to your home when the machines are ready to ship, and only for those two machines you legally purchased through eBay.

Finally, as you are aware, there is some controversy about using enhanced seats to run additional machines for which those software upgrades were not purchased. We both know that your Full Monte seats purchased for your first table Serial # (nnnnn) can run ANY PlasmaCam table, but the license agreement states that an owner will only run a table with the DesignEdge license sold with that table. We are counting on your discretion by keeping this company secret to yourself, as a public announcement of the ability to run any PlasmaCam table with an additional DesignEdge seat purchased for only $498.00 will make it quite difficult for us to sell software upgrades for each individual table a person or company may own.

Thank you in advance for your cooperation in this sensitive matter, and please advise us on how you wish to proceed with the purchase of your two GoTorch machines. We wish you great success in 2017!

John Dennigan
General Manager – PlasmaCam

cc: Jason Bulle



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