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M10/M11

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:09 pm
by djreiswig
I'm wondering if anybody has had any success with using M10/M11 to control the torch while it is moving. I would like to try and eliminate the divot that occurs when the cut is finished and motion stops, but the arc is still extinguishing. I've searched high and low for information on how to implement this without a definitive answer. I have a late 2014 Starlab with the Bladerunner Ethercut. Mach3 version R3.043.077, and SheetCam with a custom post.

I found these settings in the ESS plugin settings.
m10-m11.jpg

I'm not sure if they are set correctly, or if something needs to be changed to get this to work. I tried entering M11P1 in the MDI box and then entering an axis move but the torch output did not turn on. I also tried M10P1 and nothing happened.
I can edit the post once I get the proper syntax figured out. I believe I will need to use a cut rule to get the M10 timing correct for the material as well finding a way to turn off the DTHC to keep the torch from plunging. I read a post from Tom @ CandCNC about needing to experiment with the timing for different materials and travel speeds.

Hopefully someone else has this working and can give me some pointers.

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 10:01 pm
by djreiswig
Well, I found an old post on the forum talking about the 11M post processor that implemented the M10/M11 functionality. I modified my post processor to include M11P1 after the M03 and M10P1 after M05. I made a cut rule in SheetCam to add S10 and M10P1 before the end of the cut.
I made a simple drawing of a straight line. I set the rule to occur quite a distance from the end so I could make sure I would see the torch switch off. I turned the DTHC to manual and off and turned the plasma cutter off so it wouldn't fire.

I ran the code and the torch fired at the M03 but didn't turn off at the M10P1. It stayed on until the M05.

It also seemed like there was a momentary hesitation on the table when the cut rule line was executed.

Where do I go from here?

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 11:30 pm
by motoguy
I seem to remember a whole thread about implementing this. I don't remember if it was here, or on the CandCNC site.

ETA: maybe this will help.

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=14262&start=50

or this

https://www.candcnc.com/supportforum/vi ... =m11#p4535

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 12:20 am
by djreiswig
Thanks motoguy,
I think I remember seeing that thread on here. I don't know how I missed where it says to change the mach ESS settings.
I'll give that a try and see if changing those settings makes it work. I think I have the SheetCam stuff figured out.

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 11:16 pm
by djreiswig
I changed the settings according to the post and the gcode has both the M11P1 and M10P1 in their proper places, but the torch still is not responding to the Quick Torch Off commands. Here is how I have the ESS config settings.
screen2-s.jpg

Here is a pic of my code window showing the M11/M10.
gcode-s.jpg

Any ideas on why this isn't working?

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 12:02 pm
by SeanP
How long are are you setting it for? on finecut 3mm I would be around 2 seconds on mine.
likes of 6mm and 45a parts looking at 0.6 second on small holes.
Keep persevering it works well.

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 12:23 pm
by SeanP
I just use the quick torch off on mine not the M11P1, maybe your setup is different.

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:10 pm
by djreiswig
I was just testing it with the cutter turned off. I set it to turn off 2" before the end. The torch output LED should turn off, correct?

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:12 pm
by djreiswig
I thought I read where Tom said you had to turn it on with the M11P1 in order to get it to turn off with the M10P1. How are you getting it to work?

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:14 pm
by tcaudle
The MACH ESS handles the M10 M11 directly (or it could be delayed up to 1 sec and become worthless) As a result you have to use the ESS setings to define the M10 and M11/ The "P" call is ignored from code. Because MACH and Windows as far from real time its Ethernet communicaton to the ESS has to be buffered (put inot memory) and rolled out at the rate the actual moment is donw. As a result there is a distinct time difference between where MACH "thinks" it is and where it really is from the pulse engine.

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:44 pm
by SeanP
djreiswig wrote:I was just testing it with the cutter turned off. I set it to turn off 2" before the end. The torch output LED should turn off, correct?

I'm not sure to be honest, I'll check in the morning, I know it doesn't show in sheetcam simulation though.

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:47 pm
by SeanP
djreiswig wrote:I thought I read where Tom said you had to turn it on with the M11P1 in order to get it to turn off with the M10P1. How are you getting it to work?


This is all I do.
I'm unchecking 'include leadout' though

1.jpg


2.jpg

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:30 pm
by djreiswig
Yup. That's what I have. I did add S10 to turn the DTHC off to the code as well so it doesn't dive. What do your Mach ESS settings look like?

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:06 am
by SeanP
I'm on parallel port setup so don't have ESS settings.
Just checked and running without plasma powered up the led & relay is turning off at set distance, I set a 10mm distance to check.
I was wrong about sheetcam not showing torch off in simulation mode, maybe recent updates have sorted that now.

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 3:50 am
by AdrianH
Can I just thank the group and especially djreiswig for starting this post.

I did not know that M10/M11 existed and the potential benefits from using it as opposed to standard M3/M5. I then initially thought it was a special for the Easystepper/Smoothstepper interfaces as I could not get my system to work (straight parallel port), but with the page links and further reading and the final realisation of needing motion, my testing started to work work with the MDI screen.

The Mach3 CNC Controller Software Installation and Configuration guide does not seem to include this feature so I would not have picked it up.

Even without M11/M10 in use, it has made me dig into my setup, I found a problem in my config as I still had delays in the spindle setup which meant I was pausing with the torch on at the start of arc so my pierce delays where longer than should be.
I will move on to Sheetcam rules soon.

Again thanks to all.

Adrian

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:54 pm
by djreiswig
Hopefully you have better luck with the M10/M11 than I do. I can't seem to get it to do anything.

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 3:14 pm
by AdrianH
Yes thanks, initial live testing works.

I just used a series of 100 mm lines and in Sheetcam did a test with a rule to send M10P1 at 50mm along, no pauses from zero to 100 but the torch was switched off at 50mm.

This is a few lines of output, please I apologise, I did not have a CandCNC machine just home made.

N0010 (Date: 11/03/18)
N0020 M08 (Switch on control)
N0030 M102 (Switch on THC)
N0040 G21 (Units Metric)
N0050 G17 (XY plane)
N0060 G90
N0070 G53
N0080 G00 Z10.000
N0090 X0.0000 Y30.0000 Z10.0000
N0100 M800 (Touch off)
N0110 G00 Z1.5000 (Pierce height)
N0120 M03 (Torch on)
N0130 G01 Z1.0000 F300.0 (Cut height)
N0140 G01 X50.0000 Y30.0000 F2200.0
N0150 M10P1
N0160 G01 X100.0000 Y30.0000
N0170 M05
N0180 G00 Z10.000

What surprised me was that Mach3 recognised torch off and stopped action of the THC, mine is nothing fancy, Z is driven through Mach3 and not directly from the THC.

Adrian

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2018 4:21 pm
by djreiswig
Does anybody else have any luck getting this to work?

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2018 5:07 pm
by SeanP
It Still works fine on mine David now I'm using the 11J post, using it every day.
Keep at it, you can completely remove that blowback mark at the end or whatever name it has, takes a little tweaking for each thickness and situation.
On mine would range from 0secs on 12mm up to 2.5secs with finecut on thin stuff, it's very repeatable once you get the sweet spot though.

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:56 pm
by djreiswig
Sounds great, but I can't seem to get it to do anything on my ethercut. I'm not sure on where to go from here.

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 8:06 pm
by tcaudle
you cannot use an M10 unless you have first turn it on using an M11. Now, and M11 will not fire the ouptu assigned to M03 so you have to use both

ESS handles the calls directly

YOu do not use the "P" with the command beacuse that is assigned in the ESS conig

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 1:03 pm
by djreiswig
So, is the code I posted above incorrect? I believe that is how it is in the 11M post that I copied it from. I have the M03 and the M11 together and the M10 followed by the M05 after the final moves. Do I need to remove the P1? Is that my problem?

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 3:39 pm
by tcaudle
i don't remember on the ESS but I know it duse no tuse the ":P" command. Its possible it is not seeing it . Take off the P extension and see

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 10:16 pm
by djreiswig
I did some more experimenting with this tonight. I finally got it to work by removing the M03. If i use only the M11 to trigger the torch then M10 will shut it off early. The P1 doesn't seem to make a difference either way. I read somewhere that the M03 does some other stuff so that's why you have to have it there. My question is, what else does it do? I have S20 to turn the THC, and S10 to turn it off. Can I just use M11 and M10 for all of my cutting? Is there any reason I would want the torch to have a delay?

Re: M10/M11

Posted: Sat May 12, 2018 2:47 pm
by djreiswig
Anybody have any thoughts on this? Can I just run without the M03?