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CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

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BioGreg777
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CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby BioGreg777 » Fri Sep 30, 2016 1:17 pm

Has anyone else been plagued with varying issues with CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV issues? I was told I could purchase this system and it would work with a Thermal Dynamics Cutmaster 52 with a RAV-01 card. I had to send the ESPII controller back because the DTHC IV card was fried and never worked out of the box. The PWM module failed also and they sent me a new one. Tom and Luke have had me go down so many "rabbit holes" and none of these fixes work. If anyone else has had problems like mine please contact me.
Mach 3 Ethernet-UG
Cutmaster 52 Plasma/SL 100 machine torch
10' X 5' water table
ESP II Dragoncut controller

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exapprentice
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby exapprentice » Fri Sep 30, 2016 1:38 pm

Hi BioGreg777

apart from the initial set up of my machine (being a newbie and all that goes with it) I have had not been plagued with varying issues :!: issues yes, but Tom and Luke sorted me out and sent me in the right directions (mainly operator error's) :oops:

Did you post any of your varying issues here on plasma spider :?: and ask other members

I have stated many times in many posts how pleased I have been with the kit I purchased from CandCNC which is a big relief as I am in the UK and its not that easy to get parts shipped here without paying loads in tax for importing.
All I can add is that from day one all their kit performed as it should have apart from a cliche with my UBOB card but that was sorted straight away :D
Best Regards to all
Exapprentice :D
(Pete)
10'x5' DIY table / PM 45XP + M/C Torch - Trying to add 4 axis Tube cutting :(
Linux/CommandCandCNC MP3600 / PN200 / DCP-01 / PWM
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BioGreg777
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby BioGreg777 » Fri Sep 30, 2016 2:08 pm

Hello Exapprentice,
I used the forum on candcnc site along with calls to both Tom and Luke. Every time I use Mach 3/ Ethernet DTHC IV UG program I get differing faults in the error bar. I've heard from others that a Hypertherm torch with a CNC interface works best with the program. Tom told me that I needed a RAV-01 and I installed one. I've seen other posts where the ESPII controller didn't work "out of the box". I had to send mine back too "out of the box". I've paid thousands of $$$ to have CNC technicians help get set up and going. Still won't work correctly. Thanks

tcaudle
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby tcaudle » Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:01 pm

BioGreg777 wrote:Hello Exapprentice,
I used the forum on candcnc site along with calls to both Tom and Luke. Every time I use Mach 3/ Ethernet DTHC IV UG program I get differing faults in the error bar. I've heard from others that a Hypertherm torch with a CNC interface works best with the program. Tom told me that I needed a RAV-01 and I installed one. I've seen other posts where the ESPII controller didn't work "out of the box". I had to send mine back too "out of the box". I've paid thousands of $$$ to have CNC technicians help get set up and going. Still won't work correctly. Thanks


1. Most of the "faults" in the error bars are "informational" and show status NOT a fault. Unless you have the Hypertherm RS485 option so it displays the fault codes FROM the Hypertherm in English , there are only a couple of faults that will display. Primarily it has to do with the Min and max voltage fault being tripped .

2. The 52 cuts at different arc gap, different arc volts and different feedrates than the Hypertherm. If you cannot setup , make cuts with the DTHCIV in MANUAL mode and off and not get decent cuts on flat material then its futile to try and mix in the automation settings and expect different results. If you have a 52 you need more than just a RAV-01/02 card.

We try to set the expectation of a DIY plasma CNC table build to be one where it does not just come out of the box, get plugged in and you load and start cutting. Every table is different and there are a lot of variables we cannot control. In some circumstances the user should consider spending the extra money to buy a fully integrated turnkey table where all of the settings and testing have been done.

We go down as many rabbit holes as the customer takes us. Often we get incomplete or vague answers to specific questions. Sometimes we don't hear from a customer for days or weeks and we lose context and have to rewind and go back to the original description . The more people involved the harder it is. Sometimes the worst technical source is a "computer guy" because CNC control using a PC is not a conventional use of a computer and you cannot assume its just an application (like MS Word) running on Windows.

BTA Plasma
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby BTA Plasma » Mon Oct 03, 2016 1:46 pm

Cutmaster likes to cut at .190 but the thing to watch for is if the tip ever touches the material it will fault the plasma cutter. Thermal cutters require you to set air pressure manually for EVERY amperage you use. If you set up your hub admin, dont have any windows defender or firewall and everything plugged in correctly you should be good to go. Another thing to watch for is over tuning your THC.

Brand X
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby Brand X » Mon Oct 03, 2016 3:53 pm

BTA Plasma wrote:Cutmaster likes to cut at .190 but the thing to watch for is if the tip ever touches the material it will fault the plasma cutter. Thermal cutters require you to set air pressure manually for EVERY amperage you use. If you set up your hub admin, dont have any windows defender or firewall and everything plugged in correctly you should be good to go. Another thing to watch for is over tuning your THC.


Not all tips (Victor calls them tips) run at .1900 . some work best (lower amps) at .1600,.1400..etc...Shielded setup will not fault the plasma cutter in the shield touches the plate. It's what you should be running on 40 amps, and above. (9-8237 cup setup) My thc (3100) works flawless with either my Esab, Victor machines, or Hypertherm plasma cutters.. Using the 14 pin (50-1) or Digital Current Probe , and RAV-01 (On a cutmaster 52..)Changed over to the 14 pin CNC setup too.. Voltage is generally pretty close to book values, but the IPM is all over the board on Victor machines.. They are not for someone without lots of experience. Like the book settings of a Hypertherm, and Esab machines.. I happen to really like Victors, but not for everyone, that's for sure.. :lol:
Last edited by Brand X on Mon Oct 03, 2016 4:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

BTA Plasma
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby BTA Plasma » Mon Oct 03, 2016 4:03 pm

Yes your right. For everything steel on a cutmaster 52 your cut height is .19 and thinner stainless and aluminum will be .13 then .19 when you cross that threshold of thickness. But depending on the chart for mechanized plasma cutting you may see .19 across the board and thinner on some lower amperage cut charts. I think there were several revisions over time.

Brand X
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby Brand X » Mon Oct 03, 2016 4:11 pm

The revision can be in different size current Cutmasters manuals. Makes no sense, rime or reason..Shoot, some of the very best tip sizes are not even in any book.. 30 amps, 55 amps, 70 amps..

tcaudle
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby tcaudle » Mon Oct 03, 2016 6:55 pm

One other tidbit:

The DTHCIV watches for the move from pierce height to cut height in the code. There HAS to be a difference even if its small of the DTHC never turns on. DTHC delay starts AFTER the DTHC turns on, not when the torch fires

As I stated if you cannot setu p on a piece of flat material and make some decent cuts with the DTHC OFF then trying to force the DTHC to correct for touch off errors will end in frustration. THC is ALL about the Torch Volts (what the system reads with the torch fired . If you ge tthe wrong voltage (or no voltage) the DTHC will do its dead level best to try an MAKE the voltage right by moving the torch; often with bad results

BioGreg777
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby BioGreg777 » Wed Oct 12, 2016 11:54 am

I would like to apologize to Tom Caudle and CandCNC. After extensive conversations with Luke, sending pictures and finding water damage under the controller front cover, we believe we found the "root cause" of the problem. I hired a CNC "expert" to debugg the hardware and software and get my table running. Luke and I found that the RAV-01 voltage divider card, installed in the Cutmaster 52 was in series with an installed Thermal Dynamics CNC interface card. This is probably why I couldn't get the DTHC IV to work correctly. So.....may I suggest to anyone struggling with these types of issues to purchase the Command CNC Linux computer with the Ethernet upgrade. This will save hundreds of hours of your time. I also will suggest intense study of ready made tables to cut down on lost time and productivity. We get too soon old and too late smart.

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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby Largemouthlou » Thu Oct 13, 2016 5:47 am

Tom, Luke and the whole crew there work very hard to put out a quality product and customer satisfaction is number one to them!!
1250 hypertherm
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exapprentice
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby exapprentice » Thu Oct 13, 2016 5:56 am

I second the post above and as said before I am really glad I went with CandCNC from day one ;)
Best Regards to all
Exapprentice :D
(Pete)
10'x5' DIY table / PM 45XP + M/C Torch - Trying to add 4 axis Tube cutting :(
Linux/CommandCandCNC MP3600 / PN200 / DCP-01 / PWM
Solid Edge, Inkscape, SheetCam, Scananything & Andonstar USB Microscope

BTA Plasma
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby BTA Plasma » Thu Oct 13, 2016 10:43 am

BioGreg777 wrote:I would like to apologize to Tom Caudle and CandCNC. After extensive conversations with Luke, sending pictures and finding water damage under the controller front cover, we believe we found the "root cause" of the problem. I hired a CNC "expert" to debugg the hardware and software and get my table running. Luke and I found that the RAV-01 voltage divider card, installed in the Cutmaster 52 was in series with an installed Thermal Dynamics CNC interface card. This is probably why I couldn't get the DTHC IV to work correctly. So.....may I suggest to anyone struggling with these types of issues to purchase the Command CNC Linux computer with the Ethernet upgrade. This will save hundreds of hours of your time. I also will suggest intense study of ready made tables to cut down on lost time and productivity. We get too soon old and too late smart.



I commend you Sir. Too often folks working through the learning curve throw hard working businesses under the bus. Those that understand in the end that it was part of what you need to know to cut well RARELY send back praise publicly. CandCNC is a very serious and very results oriented supplier. The product is unbelievably top notch. Where else can you get an all in one control that eliminates a bulk components, puts them in easy to replace form and in a small package that outperforms every control in its class on the market. Not to mention designed and built in the USA. ;)

Brand X
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby Brand X » Thu Oct 13, 2016 11:42 am

Not really sure how, and the heck you mix those two components. I used both those voltage setups on a cutmaster 52, but it would take some work to figure out how to wire them together..I don't know how the Linux computer setup would stop you from doing the same thing? Unless you pieced your system together?

By the way my Computer is about 14 years old, and started out with a Retro from Tom Helping Practical CNC tables get a working THC with the old control box.. The current 3100 DTHC 1V , and one parallel cable system has been flawless running XP . Like forever too..(computer) What was really nice with the last upgrade ( had a a older thc setup that stopped working) my old 2007 box was retro to the DTHCIV THC.. I just got off the bus where I felt comfortable, because it has been so solid over the years.. Then I added a another motor to the system, and bought another gecko to install in the box..Plug and play, because everything was there in the box.Tom, even sent me the part # of the Digkey plug that goes in the box for driving the motor. That group never really forgets where they came from, and supports older systems excellent.. Some Companies it' is only about all the $$$$$ it can Milk out of It's customers.Seems Like Candcnc,and Les at SheetCam have always been about getting a work around to them. You have to always include Les in the conversation, because he has also helped make this thing work so well.. Of course the guys pushing that one flimsy table will always try say you are in the stone ages with this stuff.. Maybe so, but Support blows that $$$$ grubbing company out of the water, and they help everyone.. That's what so cool about this whole system..

tcaudle
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby tcaudle » Sat Oct 15, 2016 5:09 pm

BioGreg777 wrote:I would like to apologize to Tom Caudle and CandCNC. After extensive conversations with Luke, sending pictures and finding water damage under the controller front cover, we believe we found the "root cause" of the problem. I hired a CNC "expert" to debugg the hardware and software and get my table running. Luke and I found that the RAV-01 voltage divider card, installed in the Cutmaster 52 was in series with an installed Thermal Dynamics CNC interface card. This is probably why I couldn't get the DTHC IV to work correctly. So.....may I suggest to anyone struggling with these types of issues to purchase the Command CNC Linux computer with the Ethernet upgrade. This will save hundreds of hours of your time. I also will suggest intense study of ready made tables to cut down on lost time and productivity. We get too soon old and too late smart.


No apology necessary. Its all part of the process. I am just happy you found it!. One thing I will point out is that behind the LINUX and CommandCNC software is basically the same hardware as a Windows/MACH system . It has a different Ethernet interface and pulse card, but the DTHC is the same and the voltage pickup method is the same. A lot of people do not know that you can buy an Automation Interface card for the TD 50 80 and 100 series that has an internal (settable) divider and the ARC OK and torch fire pairs. SO you don't really need any other external cards. Pricing is higher than individual cards but it turns it into an "A" (automation) series.

Keep cuttin'!!

Brand X
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby Brand X » Sun Oct 16, 2016 9:38 am

Might as well put this info here,just to fill in a few blanks on Victor machine voltages card etc.....

The Victor 9-8211 card allows you to use the SL-100 SV machine torch with the standard Cutmaster. Without the Victor card, you will be stuck with the standard SL-100 Machine torch without the gas valve built in..It's worth having.. I had both torches, and the valve model is best overall. Cycles faster, and keeps the cycle the same between the first, and second cuts..

He was using the SL-100 torch in his post,(not SV) so that could setup a conflict in how you wanted to wire this thing up right there. If it was for a track burner the SL standard torch will have a pigtail contactor wire, instead of firing off the factory 14 pin setup.. Could confuse some people wiring it up...Not that he has the Standard SL torch, but I could see that being a issue to cause problems, if not wired in correctly..Might think you would need a Candcnc card to get it to work, but you really don't..


http://victortechnologies.com/IM_Upload ... 0-5121.pdf

It's about $180.00 on-line, or half that on e-bay used..(good day) Buying a Standard Cutmaster with the hand torch was almost always cheaper adding a automation card, SL-100SV Machine torch ,then buying a A Series machine.. Then you get a roll bar, and hand torch added for about the same price.. Same exact machine as the A-series, other then the bottom rail setup for bolting to a shelf.

Here is something most people do not know,and will help you a whole bunch getting good cuts out a Cutmaster machine.. (few more tricks too..) Use the latest Manual that comes with the Victor 82 machine...(more better) If you are cutting over 80 amps then use the larger machines like the 102/152 specs. This is for cut speed,THC voltage,pierce height, and cut height.. Then use the Air pressure and Kerf settings in the Latest A-120 manual,along with the other settings from the 82..(all are on-line.) Use shielded consumables by using the 9-8237 cup. on 40 amps, and above. 4 different shield part # for amp ranges to 120 amps.. 40 amp = 9-8245, 50/60 amps = 9-8238, 70-100 amps = 9-8239. 120 amps =9-8256 Keep the nozzles/tips matched to the amps cutting, do not jump up in amps too fast,for faster speeds as the Thickness increases. You will pay a huge penalty in bevel with the one Torch. If you follow those rules,you might just be surprised just how nice this old design of torch can be.. I am after 13-14 years of using it.. :lol: Also use the 9-8208 50/55 amp tips, and the 9-8231 70 amp tips to fill any holes in the cutting performance.. Same with the lower amp un-shielded 20-30 amp tips with the 9-8217 cup

I set everything to 50-1 on the voltage cards.. Makes going back, and forth between my Hypertherm 65, and Victor 82 (A-60 now) a snap.. same 14 pin plug...


One last note for Fabtech coming up.. I believe Thermacut is going to be there with their new Torches for the Victor machines.. It's going to get a upgrade..Looks like it will fit the Hypertherm machines too.. Very nice company to deal with.. The parent company also owns Binzel on the welding side..(not rinky dink stuff..) :lol: The booth will be together or close to each other.. Stop by, and check out the new options they might have going... I can't make it, but it would be nice to have some feedback on some other options for us...

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BioGreg777
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Re: CandCNC Ethernet DTHC IV Constant Varying Issues

Postby BioGreg777 » Mon Oct 17, 2016 11:46 am

I would like to thank all of you for the informative posts. I have had no background in CAD/CAM/CNC Plasma before 2014. I'm a metal and fused glass artist who wanted to integrate both medias into art pieces. When I first purchased the gantry and controllers I had to pay consultants to fine tune the hardware with Mach3. I never got the results I wanted because of the TD Cutmaster 52- RAV-01 wiring issues. I was able to fabricate my 10' X 5' water table and weld it up, that was the easiest part of my project. The most important lesson I learned was the need to educate myself, via You Tube videos and equipment manuals, on how to effectively operate my equipment. These posts help immensely with Cut Profiles and I have benefited from the great "pearls" of wisdom and experience posted here. Thank you all for your kind help!


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