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My Burntable

Burn Tables plasma table discussion forum
thefabguy
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My Burntable

Postby thefabguy » Wed May 07, 2014 1:28 pm

Hi all:

I just wanted to take a moment and share that I have been using the heck out of my Burntable, and its been working very well...There seems to be a lot of "bad press" about the machines at times, but I cut qty 2 full sheets of 3/16 hot rolled steel last night and the machine ran great....THC worked well, minimal dross, edges look really good...Its not always the case, but hey!...It worked very well for me....Very happy, and just wanted to share....

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bwiest
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Re: My Burntable

Postby bwiest » Fri May 09, 2014 1:13 pm

do you have an email address? I would love to ask a few questions about your setup?

Thanks,
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Coffinscreekcustoms
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Re: My Burntable

Postby Coffinscreekcustoms » Sat May 17, 2014 5:32 pm

Looking good yeah burntables catch a bad rep around here but it works for me!!

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Re: My Burntable

Postby Black Dog » Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:55 pm

Id like to ask a few questions about your setup too.
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Nacs Fab
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Re: My Burntable

Postby Nacs Fab » Wed Sep 10, 2014 2:11 pm

Can you get better pics of the edge quality? From the photo it looks fairly rough and I would not be happy with that.
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762frmafr
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Re: My Burntable

Postby 762frmafr » Wed Sep 10, 2014 6:05 pm

He conveniently forgot to post this picture. I think it's supposed to be an oval. In my opinion, this guy is a shill.

oval.jpg

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shiner2001
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Re: My Burntable

Postby shiner2001 » Wed Sep 10, 2014 6:08 pm

Nacs Fab wrote:Can you get better pics of the edge quality? From the photo it looks fairly rough and I would not be happy with that.


If you want to see some of the quality customer service you can expect from BurnTables, check out this thread on another forum. It's a tight race between which is worse, their table or their people. It's the same original post as the one I put on here (first), but the owner of BurnTables actually chimed in to show his true colors. (And my intuition would lead me to believe that the OP of THIS thread has posted both this one and his response to mine on Pirate at the bequest of BurnTables. Just my opinion though...read on and decide for yourself).

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/shop-too ... ution.html
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shiner2001
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Re: My Burntable

Postby shiner2001 » Wed Sep 10, 2014 6:09 pm

762frmafr wrote:He conveniently forgot to post this picture. I think it's supposed to be an oval. In my opinion, this guy is a shill.



Yuuuuuupppp.
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JEd
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Re: My Burntable

Postby JEd » Wed Sep 10, 2014 9:15 pm

762frmafr wrote:He conveniently forgot to post this picture. I think it's supposed to be an oval. In my opinion, this guy is a shill.

oval.jpg



While I agree that the guy is a shill, especially his creating an account just to post on Pirate, I think this is more of a file problem than a table problem. If you have straight lines instead of arcs isn't that what you will get?

762frmafr
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Re: My Burntable

Postby 762frmafr » Wed Sep 10, 2014 9:30 pm

JEd wrote:
762frmafr wrote:He conveniently forgot to post this picture. I think it's supposed to be an oval. In my opinion, this guy is a shill.

oval.jpg



While I agree that the guy is a shill, especially his creating an account just to post on Pirate, I think this is more of a file problem than a table problem. If you have straight lines instead of arcs isn't that what you will get?


I would assume it is a file problem as well. But considering I have never seen anything like it I could not be sure. First of all, it looks really bad so why would anyone purposely do this? Another thing... considering the acceleration problems of the burntables, maybe this has to be done as the table cannot produce a constant arc.

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Re: My Burntable

Postby tcaudle » Sat Sep 13, 2014 11:07 am

I would assume it is a file problem as well. But considering I have never seen anything like it I could not be sure. First of all, it looks really bad so why would anyone purposely do this? Another thing... considering the acceleration problems of the burntables, maybe this has to be done as the table cannot produce a constant arc.


Poor acceleration gets you rounded corners and fat corners on turns but typically not ragged arcs. The faster the feedrate the worse it gets. Because with CV MACH knows how close it can track the toolpath and not over torque the motors (based on the motor tuning settings...mostly acceleration)

I think in this case it indicates inherent backlash in all the axis which produces ragged cuts because both axis are moving both directions along the arc
A = F/M Acceleration = Force/Mass times efficiency

The poor acceleration is ALL it can do with a heavy 100 lb gantry and a single 480 oz/in motor to drive it.

To get acceleration you either increase the Force (motor torque X transmission ratios) or lower the Mass (measured in SLUGS on earth) which is the weight in lbs/32

You just can't cheat Physics unless you can bend gravity and warp time!

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thefabguy
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Re: My Burntable

Postby thefabguy » Wed Sep 17, 2014 9:00 pm

762frmafr wrote:
JEd wrote:
762frmafr wrote:He conveniently forgot to post this picture. I think it's supposed to be an oval. In my opinion, this guy is a shill.

oval.jpg



While I agree that the guy is a shill, especially his creating an account just to post on Pirate, I think this is more of a file problem than a table problem. If you have straight lines instead of arcs isn't that what you will get?


I would assume it is a file problem as well. But considering I have never seen anything like it I could not be sure. First of all, it looks really bad so why would anyone purposely do this? Another thing... considering the acceleration problems of the burntables, maybe this has to be done as the table cannot produce a constant arc.




Without a doubt, you guys are clowns, and nothing but a haters, specially "shiner" or whatever your screen name is....sorry you cant make parts with whatever machine you have, or don't have. I use my Burntable almost daily, and it makes me money....As I said before, I left that file with straight lines on purpose. You failed to mention that! If you don't like it, tough crap, if you do, cool, I don't care..... These forums are here to help each other, and share info, not something you would do...clearly!

Oh yes, Kyle from Burntables asked me to post something about my machine on the other forum because of the hate post you put up there. AGAIN...sorry your experience sucked, but looking at all of your posts, you need to spend your time learning how to run a plasma, and making parts.

Bottom line is this, it doesn't matter what I post; all you want to hear is that Burntables sucks, and poor poor you and how got burned....You got your money back didn't you? Move on...get over it!

Shill?....LMAO!

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Re: My Burntable

Postby Coffinscreekcustoms » Thu Feb 12, 2015 1:10 pm

well said fabguy!!! i make money with my table every month!!knowing how this system works is half the battle i have helped alot of people with there burntables yes burntables doesnt have the customer service they use to. i use to call matt at 11 at night and he would help me!! not no more b/c of drunk race guys calling him at all hours of night!!! i have had good luck with my set up!! although i do not use my THC but hey i am over it it doesnt work with my plasma!!!! but i do think that the arc sections of the cutting process is interrupted by the THC i have had guys ask about this alot!! i give burntables alot of credit i would not be where i am today with out this table. and fabguy do you have a facebook page?

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Re: My Burntable

Postby f_armer » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:54 pm

Coffinscreekcustoms wrote: yes burntables doesnt have the customer service they use to. i use to call matt at 11 at night and he would help me!! not no more b/c of drunk race guys calling him at all hours of night!!! although i do not use my THC but hey i am over it it doesnt work with my plasma!!!! but i do think that the arc sections of the cutting process is interrupted by the THC i have had guys ask about this alot!!


I think it boils down to some guys are easier to please than others, if I understood the post above, the customer service sucks, your THC doesn't work, and you can't make arcs if your THC is on? Personally I'd be a little annoyed at all that, but hey, whatever, as long as your happy! ;)
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Gamelord
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Re: My Burntable

Postby Gamelord » Thu Feb 12, 2015 5:26 pm

I try to stay out of online battles like these because you never do know the whole story and I don't have nor have ever used a Burntable to be able to say for myself.

That being said...

There have been several posts from multiple people on here who have had bad experiences and severe issues with Burntables products. One person gets a bad table...ok, it happens and that person can really stir the pot...but it's not just one person. Even the post above who is 'happy' with their Burntable lists poor customer service and incompatible hardware issues with the THC. Personally I feel that a table without a properly working THC is worthless. Not only will it eventually run the torch into the work, it won't ever have proper cut height or pierce height which produces excessive dross (money in time and grinding disks to clean) and warn out consumables (again, money and time) and destroyed pieces (cost in replacing material).

My business requires that I have good working equipment that works right every time and lasts. If I have issues with my Plasma Table or any other shop equipment, it costs me money in wasted time and materials.

My feelings on this....
There are many different types and models of Plasma Tables on the market, all around the same price as Burntables. With so many other choices and most having excellent reviews and properly working equipment/electronics/etc... I would be extremely hesitant to purchase a Burntable for my personal use or for my business. The happy feeling from the small savings you may get with the initial purchase will only last a very short time. The irritation and frustration you will get from a poorly designed or non-working piece of garbage will last forever.

In closing, I would just tell anyone looking to purchase a table to seriously do their homework and not bother so much on which table is cheapest but more on which table will be the best value for me and have the least amount of problems. After all, purchasing a table is not a impulse buy but for most, a lifetime purchase that will be around for many many years. That piece of mind is well worth a little extra for a much better table. I would shy away from Burntables and look at something else.
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tcaudle
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Re: My Burntable

Postby tcaudle » Thu Feb 12, 2015 6:46 pm

What I would like to see is a post from someone that uses their highly advertised "Tracer Technology" Does anybody have a video of it actually being used (a trace being done)? From the one setup I have seen, its a CCD camera pointing down (fairly low resolution) , and a laser cross line pointer you use to aim and "drive" the gantry with the keyboard and hand trace an object. IIts called "digitizing" and has been done for years. Even the ads for the technology do not show it actually being used. If you have to manually scroll around the table while peering at a video monitor and "mark" the edges that does not seem like a leap in technology. With a sharpie ,piece of white paper and a digital camera you could at least use one of the auto trace options in Inkscape or other packages.

Maybe I am wrong and the Tracer is not manual and you just toss a flat shape up on the table and hit a button and it traces it out and spits out a cut file for MACH to run. If it does then that WOULD be better technology.

There is some technology to actually automatically trace a flat object, It requires you have a high contrast background and the camera is a USB microscope with the LED lights. It is available from SheetCAM as "Scan Anything". And it will follow the object outlines very accurately.

http://www.sheetcam.com/Scanything/index

For now it's free and all you have to buy is a decent USB camera

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Re: My Burntable

Postby muzza » Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:04 pm

Gamelord, you are a man of knowledge and wisdom, both gained from experience and I totally agree with you.

My advice to anyone contemplating buying or building a table would be to research, research and when you have done that research some more. Speak to as many users and gain as much information as you can absorb. Take notes and pics and make a list of what really matters to you.

When you are researching you will that very few people will say "I stuffed up and bought a POS" , it's human nature, we don't like to broadcast our mistakes and errors so don't expect a lot to tell you this but when they do, take notice. You will also get the odd one in any brand that is disgruntled for one reason or another. By the same token, when you hear a person who is over the top full of crap about he has the biggest and best etc., it is often because he doesn't (here in Oz we refer to that as small dick syndrome).

So what to you do? , the same as many employers do when interviewing for a job vacancy. Take out the top and bottom marginal percentage, say 5 % and discard it and then base your judgement on whats left in the kitty. When something or someone is regularly good or regularly bad it will be clearly evident. What we see with this company is a regular pattern and in my mind using this method would see me buying another brand.

OK so some have already made the decision and purchased, what now? Again in my mind the logical thing to do would be as others have done and either work to get a credit return or make it good by throwing some more time and dollars at it but the last thing I'd do is try and BS others into thinking I got a good deal and then in the next sentence point out the downfalls, all of which are at the top of most purchasers priority list.

Another thing I'll add is that if you have only operated one table, it's very likely you think you have the best. I know I thought the original one I used was the best thing since sliced bread and I had all intentions of moving to a bigger version of the same but using another system which did take me out of my comfort zone led me to better thinking and I then went another direction.

Just my general thoughts and opinion.
Murray

cindy carlisle
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Re: My Burntable

Postby cindy carlisle » Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:30 am

What cool thing scanything looks to be, will have to try it out :D
Last edited by cindy carlisle on Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:42 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: My Burntable

Postby cindy carlisle » Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:36 am

tcaudle wrote:Maybe I am wrong and the Tracer is not manual and you just toss a flat shape up on the table and hit a button and it traces it out and spits out a cut file for MACH to run. If it does then that WOULD be better technology.

There is some technology to actually automatically trace a flat object, It requires you have a high contrast background and the camera is a USB microscope with the LED lights. It is available from SheetCAM as "Scan Anything". And it will follow the object outlines very accurately.

http://www.sheetcam.com/Scanything/index

For now it's free and all you have to buy is a decent USB camera



:) Don't think it is FREE anymore, but still it works like just like a digitizing table except a couple of extra steps. Very Cool set up with the right camera.[/quote]
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Re: My Burntable

Postby kkroger » Sun Jul 12, 2015 6:59 pm

Scanything is not FREE but the license is not astronomical either, It works QUITE well. I have been using it for a while the Camera I have is a Supereyes B005 and it works perfectly and is about $27 shipped on Amazon.

I was told by Matt at Burntables when I was shopping around the tracer tech was not a scanner but works more like a coordinate measuring machine... though the video appears to depict it as a "Scanner"

with Scanything I can scan anything that will fit on my table, I have done several items for clients that way as well. Lighting and reflectivity is important for it to pick up the edge. I used in a former job OGP Optical measuring machines and this edge finds in a similar fashion. if the lighting or reflection of the material is different it will not find the edge correctly but I have taken Shiny painted items layed them on a fresh sheet of steel.
Drawn around them with a pencil and scanned the pencil line with zero issue. Just make sure your focus is good to go, and it works with Tom's Ethercut like new money, but if you are using a USB jog box you may have a conflict with THAT. Tom's RS485 jog box would not be an issue.

Here is a video of scanning a cocacola logo right off a 12 pack box.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufJ20zdSzjE
Resultant .DXF
Now the missing cutout in the loop is my fault not the software you DO have to take it to the Edges that you want to trace. I skipped that because I was just playing and I left out the second O as well In CAD I went back and copied the interior of the first O and inserted it in the second O just because....
Image
And the resulting routed design in a scrap of Plywood.
Image

m_drunk
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Re: My Burntable

Postby m_drunk » Sun Jul 12, 2015 10:43 pm

I'm not terribly happy with Burntables for a number of reasons. First, the machine that comes with the table is crap. Ours was a refurb dell from 2004 running XP. it took a crap shortly out of "warranty". what kind of a computer has a warning that says "don't connect to the internet?" seriously? Second, the THC definitely does not work in any reasonable fashion. If I wanted to wait an extra half an hour on a cut, I'd do it by hand. Which leads me nicely into the third. That torch mount. Holy crap. 3D printed at the lowest quality settings. And every time the THC screws up, there goes another one. at a tidy sum of $35 a pop. we finally designed our own magnetic break-away model and printed it in a fine, finished quality. forth....no one gave them permission to post our works of any kind, yet, there the pictures are on their site. and finally....that has to be the worst set of belt tensioners I've ever seen. we ended up cutting new ones out of delrin on the lathe to replace the printed ones. some things are not meant to be printed, guys.

If I could go back in time, I would not get a Burntable.

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Re: My Burntable

Postby m_drunk » Sun Jul 12, 2015 10:57 pm

mentioned those torch mounts... anyone with a 3D printer should be able to suss these out. this is the version without the hole for the kill switch in it.

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